Author Topic: really fun and i think useful training exercize.  (Read 5214 times)

Offline Erigorn

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really fun and i think useful training exercize.
« on: April 04, 2015, 09:26:06 AM »
I set up a pretty simple training drill yesterday and had an awesome time.
Let me kbow know your thoughts or how to make it better.
I admit i have no formal training besides an appleseed.

Setup:
4 silhouette targets. Set up in an upside down "U" shape. Basically a left and right near and far. Near were at 7 yds and far at 15. They where half scale targets.

AR15 with sling and Taurus 92 In drop leg holster.

Smart phone or mp3 player loaded with a playlist of voice commands
I recorded left, left,left, right,right,right, stand, kneel, pistol, rifle.
I put my headphones in (the ones with squishy plastic that seals on the ear)
Set it on shuffle and repeat. Then just followed the commands.

The pistol/rifle command would switch to or stay on the firearm called out. Same with stand/kneel.

If on pistol.the left and right commands were for the near targets. Far targets for rifle.

Then just let it play until ammo was out.

Some extra details:
Timing was 3-4 Seconds per command. Enough to go from a standby position position, to safety off, Take a shot, make safe, back to standby position.  Switching firearms allowed time to double check safety and make the change.
I recorded left and right 3 times to keep the ratio of shots to Transitions better.

It was extremely fun for me. I loved the practice of operating the safety, the quick target acquisition, and switching firearms.

Things i will change:
Add a move command and have 2 shooting locations. "Move" with require transitioning from one to another.
Maybe switch the pistol and rifle commands to firearm switch to avoid a pistol callout while already holding a pistol.  Same with stance.
Make the left and right callouts with a 1 or 2 after it to designate how many shots to take. (I was doing 1 shot per callout)
Possiby add a long target requiring moving the magnifier on the ar into position. This gets complicated with the random callouts.
I need to add mag changes in. Probably just in the course of fire. I didnt have any mag pouches for either weapon. So getting those and loading mags with only 5 to 10 rounds to force frequent mag changes.

Let me know if you have any questions or comments.  I a rooking looking for training.

Now i want an airsoft setup so i can run this drill in my backyard at low cost and high frequency.

If there are major typos in this I apologize. I write from a tablet while holding a sleeping baby.

Offline Chemsoldier

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Re: really fun and i think useful training exercize.
« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2015, 01:19:58 PM »
Not a bad idea.  Just remember that past a certain level you are going to be training that particular drill, so dont be afraid to mix it up with some other stuff.

Get the mag pouches.  If you have spare rifle mags you are MUCH less likely to need to transition to a pistol.  Adding mag changes is easy once you have that.  As you said, download the mags, also just add reps, mix up the number of shots to the targets.

Lots of folks have used the flash card method in the past with a buddy, you just have a 21st century version.

Here is a good menu of drills from an excellent instructor. Most of these are pistol drills but many can also be used with rifle with minimal modification.
http://pistol-training.com/drills



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Offline David in MN

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Re: really fun and i think useful training exercize.
« Reply #2 on: April 05, 2015, 06:02:17 AM »
Throw in pushups, kettlebell swings, squats, and shoot from multiple positions (prone, standing on the shooting bench) and you've got one of my favorite summer workouts.

It's pretty hard to be accurate when you're gassed. I think more people would benefit from a workout like this.
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Offline Erigorn

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Re: really fun and i think useful training exercize.
« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2015, 11:30:32 AM »
Thanks for the replies. Good thought

I definitely need the mag change practice.
Will probably tube it a little to stay on rifle longer. Since most likely I would only change to pistol in case of malfunction or out of ammo.
Adding exercises would add another dimension that tries to replicate real situations. (Not fully accurate but closer)

I would love to set up a course and area with barriers that could be used for cover/concealment. But when using BLM land hard to set all that up. Maybe the airsoft in my backyard.


endurance

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Re: really fun and i think useful training exercize.
« Reply #4 on: April 06, 2015, 02:16:56 PM »
I'm a big fan of training with someone else and having them load your magazines.  Have them load in a snap cap or two, have them partially fill your magazines, handgun and rifle.  When your gun fails to fire, train to respond quickly and decisively, either get it back in action, go to your secondary weapon, or get the hell out of the way!  Sometimes you'll be able to clear the jam, sometimes you'll run into another malfunction (a second or third snapcap), sometimes you need to reload.  Plan for failure and failure won't be a problem when it really happens.

Offline trekker111

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Re: really fun and i think useful training exercize.
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2015, 04:28:20 PM »
Biggest change I would make is push the targets out, like 15 and 25yds, and instead of a left and right close pistol target, and left and right far rifle target, redo them as 1, 2, 3, 4, and engage any of the 4 targets with either weapon.

I would also add a misfire, and a reload command.

The weapons handling skills commands are more valuable overall then the shooting commands, and reducing the commands to one of each will give you more training for your ammunition buck.

Offline Erigorn

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Re: really fun and i think useful training exercize.
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2015, 10:35:48 AM »
I will plan on pushing targets further out. They are half scale targets so it was equivalent to about 15 and 30. Maybe do a whole series of 10 20 30 50.

I would like to practice reloads  and jams. I just don't know how.
Reloads is probably done without a command but with mags loaded to different amounts. (In the 3-8) range. I think this is best because it seems like a traditional reload when you aren't out of ammo doesn't work right. Am I wrong on that?

Malfunctions I don't know how to simulate either. Does anyone know a good way to simulate that? Is that what snap caps are for? 

endurance

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Re: really fun and i think useful training exercize.
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2015, 12:44:52 PM »
I will plan on pushing targets further out. They are half scale targets so it was equivalent to about 15 and 30. Maybe do a whole series of 10 20 30 50.

I would like to practice reloads  and jams. I just don't know how.
Reloads is probably done without a command but with mags loaded to different amounts. (In the 3-8) range. I think this is best because it seems like a traditional reload when you aren't out of ammo doesn't work right. Am I wrong on that?

Malfunctions I don't know how to simulate either. Does anyone know a good way to simulate that? Is that what snap caps are for?
Counting rounds doesn't work in the real world, but electing to reload when you have cover is still ideal. That said, feces occur. Training for running dry in the middle of a firefight is something that could save your life.

And snapcaps are just dummy rounds you load into your mags at various points to simulate failure. Or you could just own a notoriously unreliable gun and train real world. ;)

Offline trekker111

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Re: really fun and i think useful training exercize.
« Reply #8 on: April 10, 2015, 02:19:56 AM »
In a gunfight, as soon as you have a chance, you change mags. Retain your partial mag, in case you need it later, but there is no point having empty room in your gun.

For misfires, you TAP the magazine to ensure its seated well, RACK the slide or charging handle, then on your AR you can smack the forward assist if it has one, then pull the trigger and BANG.

But, its faster to just transition to your other weapon.

Offline Erigorn

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Re: really fun and i think useful training exercize.
« Reply #9 on: April 10, 2015, 08:30:37 AM »
So changing mags while there is one in the chamber is as simple as releasing the mag and putting the new one in. If you still have 1 in the chamber you are done. If it's empty then you have the normal step of the bolt release.

I guess that makes sense. I was thinking you had to rack it again and eject the chambered round. I didn't want to do that but I was not thinking clearly.

So yea I guess reload commands would be good to add. Then you have to practice reloads with a round in the chamber and one while empty.

Then add some snap caps in randomly to simulate malfunctions.

Does that all make sense and work?

endurance

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Re: really fun and i think useful training exercize.
« Reply #10 on: April 10, 2015, 12:16:04 PM »
Yep, but I still rack my handgun in reloads because I have a nasty habit of resting my thumb on the slide release, so I never know when I've fired the last round until it goes click. Ymmv

Offline David in MN

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Re: really fun and i think useful training exercize.
« Reply #11 on: April 10, 2015, 01:46:00 PM »
I always rack. Train to do it one way... the way that always works. I guess I'd rather have a live round on the ground than risk an empty chamber. And nobody (other than Sergeant York) has that much knowledge of just how many more rounds are in the weapon when in a firefight.
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Offline trekker111

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Re: really fun and i think useful training exercize.
« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2015, 12:23:59 AM »
Yip, always rack. During critical incident stress, such as duringba gunfight, most people experience a marked reduction in fine motor skills, such as those required to manipulate the slide release. Racking the slide is a gross motor skill.

There are so many reports of cops and soldiers not being able to manipulate their slide release during during real world reloads that when I went to the academy range, if you used your slide release, you instantly failed.