Author Topic: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey  (Read 83883 times)

Offline outdoorman63

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #60 on: May 17, 2010, 03:05:27 PM »
the only gold i have been attempting to buy are us "mid to late 1800's"1 dollar coins that were used in jewelry or just have lost there numasmatic value, have been getting them for under 75 each

Offline tamo42

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #61 on: May 17, 2010, 05:44:10 PM »
wdrobins, I agree with your general approach. Personally, I employ weekly credit spreads with the dominant trend in various broad markets.  But that's just a matter of technique.

However, I'd add a bit of caution.  If the S hits the F suddenly, you could be exposed to tail-end risk if you're not hedged in gold/silver/oil at the time.  This is why I have a combination of short and long term positions.

Offline wdrobins

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #62 on: May 17, 2010, 07:48:56 PM »
Thanks for the advice tamo42.  Your strategy is a good one. 

I assume what you mean is that you are using options to execute a vertical (credit) spread, whereby you sell an OTM (out of the money) option with a strike possibly close to the current share price, and simultaneously buy an option at a strike further away having the same expiration date.  You thus have a net credit to your account.

Unfortunately, I can't execute these types of option strategies in my cash IRA, which is not allowed to be a margined account.  About all I can do with options is buy calls and puts, and execute covered calls.  I actually tested my account one day by trying to do a spread, but the order was rejected (as I knew it would be). I'm not quite sure if not allowing a credit spread in a cash account is a function of this particular broker, or an SEC regulation.

Given these limitations, I am pretty much just sticking with basic trend following techniques using both long and inverse ETFs.  I manage risk by setting initial stops and position sizing based on maximum loss of 1 or 2% of my account in any one trade. Sometimes I might risk more if the conditions and expected return justify it.  I figured I'm getting additional security from trading relatively high volume ETFs (as opposed to single stocks), which are not as likely to have large overnight gaps due to bad news.

If you have any ideas on how I can do this better, given these limitations, I'm listening.

Offline tamo42

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #63 on: May 18, 2010, 12:35:40 AM »
wdrobins, you're right that I use vertical OTM credit spreads.  The limitations on your account are due to your broker, not the SEC.  I do these trades in Roth IRAs all the time (using optionsXpress as a broker).  Granted, you do need to have margin enabled to short anything even though you don't use the margin for the trade.

If you can only go long though, your strategy makes sense.  But that's all for another topic we can discuss somewhere else :).

More related to the topic, yes, Dave Ramsey is great at getting people out of debt, but his investment advice is definitely non-optimal.  I still listen occasionally and he very clearly believes in a general rising of markets over time.  This is the inflationary viewpoint that has been true for the last 100 years.

What it fails to consider is that the game can change.  Many of us here believe that the rules of the general society will be changing in the foreseeable future.  Maybe not today or tomorrow, but probably within our lifetimes.  In my opinion, this latest round of fiat currency has begun its death throes.  In reaction, we'll move back to sound(er) money.

Offline bkt

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #64 on: May 19, 2010, 05:27:53 AM »
I'm confused. An investment -- particularly a long-term investment -- is made relative to the currency you use to buy stuff. If it is known, and it is, that our currency is overvalued and that inflation looks very likely, what is the argument for investing at all? That is, why dump cash into something that will return more cash if the cash itself is devalued significantly by the time you get it?

The benefit to buying precious metals is they hold their value relative to other commodities very well over time. Buying gold and silver isn't so much an investment as a hedge against the bottom dropping out of the dollar.

Offline wdrobins

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #65 on: May 19, 2010, 08:30:44 AM »
bkt,

You make a good point. However, more cash after inflation is better than less cash after inflation.  Some of us have been suckered into things like 401k plans and IRAs, so it is wise to manage that cash for as long as we have it, and, of course, do all the other things, in regards to prepping as well.




Offline tamo42

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #66 on: May 19, 2010, 09:38:50 AM »
There are two other reasons to invest using USD.  First, if you can stay ahead of inflation, you come out better than you went in.  Second, it's very difficult to redeem anything for gold/silver because the official currency is USD.

And besides, I'd rather have the stuff than the USD in many cases :).

Offline templar223

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #67 on: May 19, 2010, 09:49:54 AM »
The purchase of precious metals (PMs) always seems to arouse the passions in some folks.

Frankly, putting any form of passion in your investment decisions is a recipe to financial disaster.

Especially those folks who buy gold to "hedge" against inflation using borrowed money (thus earning them the privilege of paying interest on their hedge).


Consider gold dispassionately and I think you'll find it's only potential value is for the novelty and certain "niche" uses that could be better described as insurance against certain unlikely scenarios (unlikely being a kind way of putting it).

Frankly, I think Dave Ramsey is outstanding at offering plans to get people out of debt and staying out of debt.  I don't think his investment advise is nearly as good though, but in this case, another man I have the utmost respect for agrees with Ramsey, albeit for slightly different reasons.

Here's what Karl Denninger over at Market Ticker Forums wrote about gold.  I respect the man and his thoughtful analysis of gold as an "investment".

http://market-ticker.org/archives/134-The-Year-In-Review-And-a-Look-Ahead-for-2008.html

This is from Dec 2007
There are also a number of people who believe, despite all the evidence above, that the government (or "The Fed") will "hyperinflate" to "save the economy" (or at least try.) Typically these people also believe that the rest of the world will fare better than we will, and will come in to snap up assets in America that are "dirt cheap" as our dollar is debased.

This is the central thesis of the "Gold Bug" paradigm; these folks all believe Gold is going to go to $1500 (or more) in the next year, and they urge you to buy some as a result.

The problem is that if their thesis is correct they're total idiots to buy Gold!

Here's why.

Let's say that the dollar is debased by 50% from here and Gold doubles in price (in dollars.) You make 100%, right? Wrong - you are subject to a 28% collectibles tax on the appreciation, so you in fact lose compared to inflation. Congratulations - you lost real purchasing power!

That isn't so good.

Well, what could you do if you believe that the government will "hyperinflate" that would stay ahead of it?

In a hyperinflation paradigm where the rest of the world "does better than we do" stock markets will do a moonshot as foreign money comes in to buy all the "cheap" assets. The Dow will likely double if the dollar gets cut in half. But let's say it doesn't double - it only goes up by 30%, to 20,000 by the end of the year in 2008.

Why would you not buy Index CALLs instead of Gold?

A LEAP January 2009 DIA $160 CALL was selling for $2.00 Friday (Bid x Ask at $1.94/$2.10).

Let's say you buy 100 of those contracts for $20,000 (each contract is 100 shares, so 100 x 100 x $2.00 = $20,000, plus commission of course)

If the Dow goes to 20,000 by the end of next year, your CALLs are worth $40 each! That is a 20x profit on your original investment; that $20,000 turns into $400,000!

Further, if the DOW DID double (ala China's Shanghai Market) your little $20,000 wager would turn into a staggering $1,400,000 in one year's time!

So tell me again - if you believe in "hyperinflation" - why do you want to buy the clear LOSER of an asset that metals represent, when you can buy index CALLs and, if your thesis is correct, you will make an absolute stinking FORTUNE!

(Of course if you're wrong and the DOW is under 16,000 by the end of the year, that $20,000 is totally flushed. That's the price of poker - but again - just how sure are you that "The Fed" is going to "hyperinflate"? And by the way, no, I don't think they are - in fact, I don't think they CAN.)

To those who go even further and are in “It’s the end of the world as we know it” camp, I will humbly suggest that you remove the tin from your hat. It not only isn’t now but also won’t be tomorrow.

America has faced Depressions in the past, and our nation has survived. Yes, I used the plural form of the word. Most think the 1930s was “Our Time”. Wrong. There is a long cycle in credit (typically 50-80 years) that is well-understood among those who study this stuff called the “Kondratiev Wave.” This economic theory posits that credit moves in long cycles, with the evils of “overexpansion” being repeated once the previous generation that experienced its effects are all (or mostly all) dead. America has gone through three of these cycles previously, and we are likely in “winter” of the fourth now.

The “winter” periods tend to be deflationary credit collapses.

==========================================


So, the bottom line is that if you REALLY are sold on the idea that the dollar is going to "collapse" and gold is going to the moon, there are market options you can buy which will make you a very, very wealthy person if this indeed comes to pass.

However, if you're wrong, you lose the entire amount that you have placed as a "bet" on this position.

So, again, how sure are you, dispassionately speaking?

John

Offline tamo42

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #68 on: May 19, 2010, 10:59:34 AM »
templar223, the flaw in that analysis is that it assumes the general financial structure of world trade will remain intact.  That's entirely possible, and in such a case, I would agree that playing options that have exponential benefit with linear loss is a good move.

In a real SHTF scenario though, the whole market falls apart, but people will still need a commodity that is accepted universally in trade to purchase things they need and want.

Again, the primary function of gold is as a store of value.  The nominal gains it has made ever since it was $20/ounce up until 1933 to $1200/ounce now has not really made it more valuable.  It's just that the counting unit we're using (USD) have gotten smaller.

Offline wdrobins

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #69 on: May 19, 2010, 11:31:57 AM »
Good point tamo42!

Hare of Caerbannog

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #70 on: May 19, 2010, 12:04:16 PM »
Recently I saw an interview where some CNBC brainless drone was asking Ron Paul about his faith in gold. She was yammering on about how Ron Paul had made these predictions about gold and the dollar since the '70s.
Ron Paul answered by saying something like, "Yea, I know. I foolishly began buying gold in the '70s when it was $35 dollars an ounce and now those same coins are selling for some $1200 an ounce, so I guess I look pretty silly."

So we can look at facts or we can go on believing a financial system based on fiat (aka, faith) will keep working forever.
There's a reason they USED to call it "cold hard cash". That's because cash used to be cold and hard. The dollar is neither. It is faith based financing.

Offline Cowtown44

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #71 on: May 19, 2010, 12:33:27 PM »
Thanks for the advice tamo42.  Your strategy is a good one. 

I assume what you mean is that you are using options to execute a vertical (credit) spread, whereby you sell an OTM (out of the money) option with a strike possibly close to the current share price, and simultaneously buy an option at a strike further away having the same expiration date.  You thus have a net credit to your account.

Unfortunately, I can't execute these types of option strategies in my cash IRA, which is not allowed to be a margined account.  About all I can do with options is buy calls and puts, and execute covered calls.  I actually tested my account one day by trying to do a spread, but the order was rejected (as I knew it would be). I'm not quite sure if not allowing a credit spread in a cash account is a function of this particular broker, or an SEC regulation.

Given these limitations, I am pretty much just sticking with basic trend following techniques using both long and inverse ETFs.  I manage risk by setting initial stops and position sizing based on maximum loss of 1 or 2% of my account in any one trade. Sometimes I might risk more if the conditions and expected return justify it.  I figured I'm getting additional security from trading relatively high volume ETFs (as opposed to single stocks), which are not as likely to have large overnight gaps due to bad news.

If you have any ideas on how I can do this better, given these limitations, I'm listening.

wdrobins,

Where did you get your education to set up this system? I'm returning back to running our portfolio after a 10 yr absence. I have traded options in the past so I'm familiar with that part. Thanks.

Offline bkt

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #72 on: May 19, 2010, 01:59:29 PM »
templar223, the flaw in that analysis is that it assumes the general financial structure of world trade will remain intact.  That's entirely possible, and in such a case, I would agree that playing options that have exponential benefit with linear loss is a good move.

In a real SHTF scenario though, the whole market falls apart, but people will still need a commodity that is accepted universally in trade to purchase things they need and want.

Again, the primary function of gold is as a store of value.  The nominal gains it has made ever since it was $20/ounce up until 1933 to $1200/ounce now has not really made it more valuable.  It's just that the counting unit we're using (USD) have gotten smaller.
Yes, exactly right.

Buying gold or silver is not done (by me, anyway) in anticipation of cashing them in again later.

If there is no SHTF scenario then hey -- I've got gold and silver to pass on to my kids. That doesn't suck.

Offline Pathfinder

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #73 on: May 19, 2010, 02:34:09 PM »
Recently I saw an interview where some CNBC brainless drone was asking Ron Paul about his faith in gold. She was yammering on about how Ron Paul had made these predictions about gold and the dollar since the '70s.
Ron Paul answered by saying something like, "Yea, I know. I foolishly began buying gold in the '70s when it was $35 dollars an ounce and now those same coins are selling for some $1200 an ounce, so I guess I look pretty silly."

So we can look at facts or we can go on believing a financial system based on fiat (aka, faith) will keep working forever.
There's a reason they USED to call it "cold hard cash". That's because cash used to be cold and hard. The dollar is neither. It is faith based financing.

Sorry - on a roll here. Last night I had to correct the 6 candidates for the 2 City Council positions that ours is not a democracy (as the HS senior (!!!) running for one of the positions announced - and the rest agreed), it is a constitutional republic. So, Hare, you're next.

Fiat does not mean faith, fides is Latin for "faith". Fiat means "is commanded" as in the US gummint commands us that the value of the dollar is X, rather than the value being tied to some standard.

I think the confusion comes in with the phrase "full faith and credit of the US gummint" when talking about backings for t-bills etc.

Just trying to be helpful . . .    ;D

Hare of Caerbannog

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #74 on: May 19, 2010, 02:39:39 PM »
Well, Pathfinder, I didn't intent to infer that to be a direct Latin translation, although I could get particular and point out both words come from the same root.
To understand not only the meaning of fiat currency but to also understand my statement above, I would recommend this thread.
http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=14938.0

Offline wdrobins

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #75 on: May 19, 2010, 02:56:30 PM »
Cowtown44,

Is your question about how I do the trend following strategy, coupled with risk management?

Offline chrisdfw

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #76 on: May 26, 2010, 07:22:38 PM »
Ramsey is an optimist with a financial education and makes the fallacy of relying on past history to predict future performance.
Prior to 2001 you could say it is impossible for terrorist to fly two jumbo jets into the world trade center, it has never happened.

The US economy is a mere blip in history, slightly more than 200 years. It has never failed, but that doesn't mean it can't.
BUT I do believe gold is a terrible investment, why? because it provides no output. Same as most so-called growth stocks.

I want my investments to produce something for me, generally that something is cash flow, but I will accept real output or
even avoided cost. To me real investments produce, generally in a short period of time if not immeadiately. IF you have
to rely in the value increasing you are speculating in my mind. IF you buy a business you should expect cash flow in the form
of dividends on owners draws, etc. This goes for a small business, real estate, or even a stock.

Gold to me is a hedge. A valuable hedge like silver, but I would not consider it an investment. It is either a hedge or speculation.

For me I don't like to speculation so its a hedge. Next year when my income goes up, I plan to try and buy either 25 ounces of silver or
1/2ounce of gold a month (since the historical average cost ratio is about 25:1) If it goes down I may buy more

Offline beachwalker

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #77 on: June 04, 2010, 05:07:22 PM »
My feelings are these. Gold/silver is an awefully big egg in a single basket. Certainly a consideration but I'm not comfortable owning substantail amounts.

As far as Dave... I love Dave but he is clueless. He preaches to give every dollar a name, save money, and use common sense until it's time to invest. Then Dave's investment advice consists of paying a broker 5% sales load for an "easy" 12% return.

Very contradictory IMHO... and it's because he gets paid to push these brokerage products.

The risk involved to achieve 12% is severe.






Offline wdrobins

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #78 on: June 05, 2010, 07:56:06 AM »
Quote
Then Dave's investment advice consists of paying a broker 5% sales load for an "easy" 12% return.

beachwalker,

I'm curious to know where the 5% load and 12% return numbers come from.  I have to admit I haven't been following Dave Ramsey.  Are these numbers that Dave Ramsey is using to convince people to invest according to his "classical" methodology?

Offline chrisdfw

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #79 on: June 05, 2010, 01:11:01 PM »
wdrobins, you're right that I use vertical OTM credit spreads.  The limitations on your account are due to your broker, not the SEC.  I do these trades in Roth IRAs all the time (using optionsXpress as a broker).  Granted, you do need to have margin enabled to short anything even though you don't use the margin for the trade.

I want to add a second for optionsxpress as a broker. I have used them and love them.

I currently have my money tied up elsewhere and am saving for a relocation but will go back to them.

Offline wdrobins

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #80 on: June 05, 2010, 01:19:05 PM »
chrisdfw (or anyone else),

I suppose we're getting a little off topic here, but do you have any experience with Interactive Brokers.  I believe their rates are better than optionsXpress?

Offline beachwalker

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #81 on: June 05, 2010, 02:30:51 PM »
Give kudos to Dave Ramsey for getting people out of debt. He gives very sound advice.

But when he says to invest thru his ELP's it seems an inherent conflict in interest.

Why not tell people to simply invest the most cost efficient manner via index funds?

Why not tell people to find a fee based advisor?

He gets a check for any referral sent to his ELP.

The American Family of funds which the ELP/broker directs the referral to invest charge any number of front end or back loads which go to the ELP/broker... every time he tells you to change investments he gets a fat cut.

A broker has no fiduciary duty to their clients, and that is why the bad ones give the good ones a bad name.

A fee based investment advisor does have a fiduciary responsibility and is probably closer to the heart of a teacher that Dave tells investors to seek. Yes they make 1% or a little more off the top but they are far better than a broker IMHO.

Just my 2 cents




Offline wdrobins

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #82 on: June 05, 2010, 07:56:36 PM »
I also give Dave Ramsey big kudos for helping people get out of debt.  In addition, he is given big time kudos for learning from his mistakes, getting off his back end, and starting his own business as an entrepreneur - something that most people under the same circumstances would not have done.  Anyone who can make millions just giving common sense advice is to be admired.  We should all learn from these types of people.  It has been said that you should not give advice on how a man should run his business unless you are making a lot more money than he.  This is good advice, but at the same time we don't leave our brains on the door mat either.

I personally don't put much faith in Ramsey's long term investment advice aimed at the masses.  Most other financial advisers (fee-only or not) act according to the same set of basic assumptions about long term investing, of which I find flawed.  Therefore, as a somewhat free American, I willing choose to actively manage my own money.  One day, when I get some time, I intend to write an article proving mathematically why most financial counselor investment techniques are not optimal.  But, in the mean time, I am perfectly happy not conforming to the average statistic.  I am what you might call an outlier on the bell curve.  ;)

Offline RightArmOfWyoming

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #83 on: July 02, 2010, 01:15:52 PM »
I've heard Ramsey say he stockpiles ammo instead. Not for protection (!) but to use as ammo. Boston T. Party makes the same recommendation, but also recommends it for protection, and also recommends gold.

Offline hanzel

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #84 on: July 18, 2010, 02:39:49 PM »

The US economy is a mere blip in history, slightly more than 200 years. It has never failed, but that doesn't mean it can't.
BUT I do believe gold is a terrible investment, why? because it provides no output. Same as most so-called growth stocks.


You forget the first US currency, the Continental, did fail, that is why the Constitution mandated the only Gold and Silver could be money.  You are correct that gold ( and silver ) provides no output, that is because it is not an investment, it is money.  You take money and invest it into something in the hope that you will get more money back. The Federal Reserve has spend almost 100 years trying to convince us that debt is money and gold and silver are some sort of investment instead of the truth, it is the Federal Reserve Note that is the investment ( a debt based note ).

Offline RationalHusker

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #85 on: July 29, 2010, 11:31:02 AM »
I listened to maybe 20 or so Dave Ramsey podcasts, and stopped after I heard his opinion on gold.  He dispenses good advice to his callers, but the message gets repetitive after a while.  Physical gold is a store of value, a hedge, an insurance policy, it is "cash" under the mattress.....  what it is not is an investment.


Here's what Dave Ramsey had to say about Peter Schiff (and his father, Irwin).  In hindsight, this makes Ramsey look a little silly.  But like most, I do appreciate his message about debt. 

Dave Ramsey calls Peter Schiff an idiot

Offline dudekrtr

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #86 on: July 29, 2010, 10:15:02 PM »
It's really too bad that such a presumably gifted financial writer, or, more accurately, performer, is losing so much money for his followers. Since he can't really argue his points, he has to twist what the other person is saying and call him an idiot. The stock market can certainly crash to 6000, or 4500, or even 1000; but, sure, it IS literally impossible for it to go to zero. Schiff never said anything like that. Since those who have taken his advice have lost so much already, while Schiff's followers have not only preserved their wealth (which is the purpose of gold, it's not an " investment" like Ramsey and his ilk insist on calling it. An "investment" would be, for example , a gold MINE. Why is it so hard to get the "experts" to understand something so simple? Or, do they really understand and just can't say what the truth really is without losing their sponsors?), they have managed a 20 or 30 percent gain in the same time frame.

It pretty much comes down to the bankster gangsters having yet another shill to get folks to part with their hard-earned money for some investment vehicle, headed down the wrong way on a one-way street. The bankers win, Joe Lunchbucket loses. Again. Fight back, Joe; get some gold and silver.

Hey, maybe Dave can run for the Senate, too, and he and Peter can duke it out on the Senate floor.

Offline wdrobins

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #87 on: July 30, 2010, 09:09:31 AM »
Here is Dave's advice:

"Put your retirement money in growth stock mutual funds with a track record of at least five years of consistent returns (12% average). Divide your portfolio equally among growth, growth and income, international and aggressive growth funds."

I did a quick search at Fidelity on no-load mutual funds, which included non-Fidelity funds, for returns averaging 15% or less.  I then sorted the search results by 5 year and 10 year returns, highest to lowest.  Guess what.  All funds having at least 12% on a 5 year basis were PRECIOUS METALS funds and foreign emerging markets type funds.  If you sort on a 10 year basis, the only fund that achieved a 12% return that was not totally specialty focused and contained a significant percentage of U.S. stocks was the Yacktman Focused fund (which does not meet Dave's 5 year requirement) with the following results:

YTD: -4.77%  1 Yr: 20.06%  3 Yr: 5.88%  5 Yr: 7.26%  10 Yr: 12.49%

If you try to construct a portfolio of a mixture of growth, growth and income, and international and aggressive growth funds, I doubt very seriously that you will come up with an historic average return of 12% based on 5 year returns, or even 10 year returns.  No matter how you construct a portfolio based on most financial liars advice, keep in mind that historic numbers "are not indicative of future results" as most financial small print is quick to point out.

Dave seems to be very trusting of the U.S. stock market and economy.  As I have heard him say, "Politicians come and go, but the markets will always be there."  In other words, what has always been, will always be.  This optimistic faith reminds me of the Roman Empire, where the leaders convinced themselves and the people that Rome was eternal.  It would always be there. 

In my opinion, Dave is trapped in a baby boomer time warp, where his assumptions are somewhat rose colored with regard to the economy.  Since the year 2000, we have entered an unprecedented time in American history on an economic front.  Globalization, the destruction of capitalism and free markets, toxic assets, and the threat of sovereign debt default, amongst other things, both here and abroad is taking us into uncharted waters.

I think it is time to quit listening to leaders who are paradigm deficient, and think mostly of their own interests.  The people who are going to survive are the ones who can think for themselves, use common sense, and follow the Boy Scout motto -- Be Prepared!

Offline Morgan96

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #88 on: July 31, 2010, 06:13:47 AM »
heard a Dave Ramsey show recently. Now he's pimping for goldstashforstash.com.   "Get rid of that useless gold, trade it in for (mostly green) paper coupons".


Hare of Caerbannog

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Re: Gold is a Terrible Investment - According to Dave Ramsey
« Reply #89 on: August 03, 2010, 07:00:45 AM »
Great video RationalHusker!
+1 for you!

Well worth the 9 minutes it takes to watch it.
Take special note of the part when Ramsey starts listing huge companies and says the only way the stock market could crash is if huge companies "closed their doors" at the same time the video shows huge companies that DID close. Then he talks about how the resignation of Nixon and the attack on 9/11 didn't bring on a crash. This indicates he has absolutely no idea what causes a stock market crash. He then says that we can't have a crash because our markets and our banking is structured differently than before the great depression and it can't crash now. At that point he is either intentionally lying to deceive people or he has no idea how the market works. There is no third choice.
Listen to what he says about gold. This was when gold was around $600 an ounce. Its running around $1200 an ounce right now. Again, either he doesn't understand that gold is not a commodity like corn, or he is lying.
If someone took Schiff's advice in January 2008 and dumped their stocks and bought gold, not only would that have saved their investment from being cut in half, they would have doubled their money.