The Survival Podcast Forum

Farm, Garden and The Land => Permaculture, Land Management and Foraging => Topic started by: may214 on May 09, 2013, 11:47:53 AM

Title: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: may214 on May 09, 2013, 11:47:53 AM
Has anyone had success trying to replace the climbing layer, i.e. taking out poison ivy by providing a competing vine layer plant?

If not, what are your best poison ivy control stratagems short of nuking it with Roundup?  I've had some limited success with a basic sheet mulch over the top of ground cover PI.  I've hacked away at the base of the larger climbing vines that I can see, and it looks like those vines have some withering leaves up in the canopy.  I have a wealth of blackberries intermingled with some dense PI, so I'd like to avoid chemical applications - even the organic ones like vinegar/salt.  I suppose I could try some spot torching with a little portable butane torch.

Appreciate any replies (or redirection to previous thread.

prep on.
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: LJH on May 09, 2013, 11:58:58 AM
Goats! They love the stuff - buy, adopt, rent or steal some goats.  ;)
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: Crazy Fox on May 09, 2013, 12:41:35 PM
Goats! They love the stuff - buy, adopt, rent or steal some goats.  ;)

That's a great idea, I never would have thought of using goats.

Looks like there are only a couple things to consider:

1) "... you risk the poison ivy/oak itch if you come into contact with the goats for a certain period of time after they have eaten it [poison oak/ivy]. This also applies to drinking the milk they produce and you may consume."
-http://www.goatworld.com/articles/brushcontrol/brushcontrol.shtml

2) I've read that goats love blackberry plants, so this method may wipe out the blackberries too.
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: David in MN on May 09, 2013, 02:14:59 PM
I knew a guy a while back who filled a plastic cup with Roundup and used a Q-tip to delicately paint exactly the plants he wanted dead. Before you go around killing the stuff you better ask yourself why it's there.
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: archer on May 09, 2013, 02:40:28 PM
Before you go around killing the stuff you better ask yourself why it's there.

to make my life hell?
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: LJH on May 09, 2013, 02:41:32 PM
to make my life hell?

 :rofl:
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: jeepster on May 10, 2013, 04:05:39 PM
I work with a guy who uses old gas out of boats (with the 2 stroke oil mixed in). He sprays it on and the plants die. I know this is extreme but it works.

Other than that personally I cut it down and let it sit for a week then using a rake I pile it up and burn it. DON'T breath the smoke!!!

I have been thinking about planting bamboo in hopes to choke it out.
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: may214 on May 19, 2013, 08:37:38 AM
Looks like we got the Jack Spirko answer on Friday's listener call-in.

To recap for those who may have missed it (or search for this topic at some point in the future)

Option 1 - Land which you don't mind opening up and clearing intermediate cover to let full sun in.  Poison Ivy likes shade, and will die in full sun (at least by the second season).

Option 2 - For land you intend to keep in partial or full shade.  Cut it to the ground, cover it with sopping wet cardboard, cover that with 3-4 inches of mulch.  Then, introduce a competing plant to disadvantage the Poison Ivy.  Make little "moon craters" in the mulch 4-6" in diameter to expose the cardboard.  Put a one inch hole in the cardboard.  Add some compost to the crater and introduce your competing plants.  Jack mentioned 3 - Virginia Creeper, Jewel Weed, and English Ivy.  Jewel Weed is a great choice, because it also happens to be an effective treatment for poison ivy contact. 

Jack also mentioned two "scorched earth" options.  Literally.  Clear the ground of the stems and leaves of the poison ivy, then take a torch to the root systems you uncover.  BE CAREFUL - smoke from poison ivy is bad news.  Inhaled, it can cause some severe respiratory reactions requiring hospitalization.  Just scorch the roots that are in the ground.  The second system of "scorched" earth involved injecting steam into the ground to sterilize and scorch the roots.  It is doubly important to have some replacement species ready to plant.

Thoughts on Jack's recommendations?
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: may214 on May 19, 2013, 08:46:00 AM
Some info on Jewel-Weed.

http://www.wildmanstevebrill.com/Plants.Folder/Jewelweed.html

And much the same information, but different pictures and some different applications here:

http://wildedibleandmedicinalplants.blogspot.com/2010/07/jewelweed.html
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: TexDaddy on May 19, 2013, 01:02:16 PM
Be careful about torching the poison ivy.

A friend of my nearly killed himself breathing the smoke put off by burning poison ivy. Having that rash on the inside of your lungs is a real downer.
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: cheryl1 on May 19, 2013, 01:11:15 PM
find someone who's not allergic and have them cut down the vines for you
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: r_w on May 20, 2013, 08:28:19 AM
Be careful about torching the poison ivy.

A friend of my nearly killed himself breathing the smoke put off by burning poison ivy. Having that rash on the inside of your lungs is a real downer.

+1000000!!!

You can also be held liable if a neighbor inhales that smoke! 

Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: dantesrebellion on July 05, 2013, 09:56:53 AM
Live and let live. It is all over my fences. I call it natural home security.
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: soupbone on July 05, 2013, 02:50:59 PM
Live and let live. It is all over my fences. I call it natural home security.

Yep - it's really a very pretty plant. Transplant it and let it grow up the side of your house. ALARM SYSTEM?!? I don' need no stinkin' alarm system!!!

soup
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: may214 on July 05, 2013, 05:31:24 PM
That would require a substantial botanical education drive to ensure that potential invaders could identify poison ivy.  Perhaps one of those yard signs like you see for home security?  WARNING: These premises protected by biological toxins!
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: dantesrebellion on July 05, 2013, 08:02:25 PM
That would require a substantial botanical education drive to ensure that potential invaders could identify poison ivy.  Perhaps one of those yard signs like you see for home security?  WARNING: These premises protected by biological toxins!

Not much botanical education required. Pretty much everyone here in the south knows what it looks like and has a fairly good idea of how allergic to it they are. Leaves of 3, leave them be and all that.
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: LibertyBelle on July 10, 2013, 12:50:43 PM
Goats! They love the stuff - buy, adopt, rent or steal some goats.  ;)

100% in agreement there. They took out all of our poison ivy, as well as some invasive honeysuckle, multifloral rose, some brush, and a big patch of non-fruiting briers we were plagued with. As long as they had all that stuff to chow down on, they didn't even bother the grass (other than to naturally fertilize it, LOL). Goats are more of browsers than grazers.
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: Cedar on July 10, 2013, 01:02:45 PM
Just don't pet the goats for weeks until the oils disapate off them.

My friend Tegan was cutting Poison Oak and without burning it inhaled the oils in the air on a hot day. She got it into her lungs and it went systemic inside her. BE CAREFUL!


Cedar
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: LibertyBelle on July 10, 2013, 01:31:24 PM
My friend Tegan was cutting Poison Oak and without burning it inhaled the oils in the air on a hot day. She got it into her lungs and it went systemic inside her. BE CAREFUL!

BTDT, and had to go to the hospital and was on a high dose of steroids for a couple of weeks. But on the plus side, that was the first and only time in well over 10 years that I've been pain free. 
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: may214 on July 12, 2013, 01:45:55 PM
Clearly, I've been in the garden too long, and need to spend more time online.

I had to look up BTDT. 
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: LibertyBelle on July 12, 2013, 02:06:43 PM
Clearly, I've been in the garden too long, and need to spend more time online.

Naw...just surround yourself with 4 internet/iphone savvy teens.  ;D
One of my teens was even texting while helping me pick beans yesterday (don't ask me how she managed to do it).
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: Arkie444 on May 25, 2017, 07:28:27 AM
I heard yesterday at a healthfood store where I was buying some poison ivy homeopathic pills that you can cut open a stem, submerge it into roundup, and the plant will suck it down into the roots and kill itself.  I hate chemicals, but this is maybe one way to responsibly use them in a limited conservative fashion.  I will be trying it this summer!
Title: Re: Permaculture's anwer to poison ivy?
Post by: redrider on September 13, 2017, 07:58:16 AM
I heard yesterday at a healthfood store where I was buying some poison ivy homeopathic pills that you can cut open a stem, submerge it into roundup, and the plant will suck it down into the roots and kill itself.  I hate chemicals, but this is maybe one way to responsibly use them in a limited conservative fashion.  I will be trying it this summer!

IMHO, if you're going the chemical direction, I would use "Tordon". Cut the stem close-ish to the roots and dab Tordon (with a cheap or old small paintbrush) on the lower portion. I believe you only need to dab it on the cadmium (sp?) layer, but poison ivey stems are usually not so large that I dab it on the whole stem.

That said, I'm looking for goats!

rr