The Survival Podcast Forum

Survivalism & Self Sufficiency Topics => Transportation => Topic started by: theBINKYhunter on March 05, 2014, 07:34:07 PM

Title: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 05, 2014, 07:34:07 PM
Been wanting to get on two wheels again but can't spring for a new or used bike (that I would want). Ran across a project bike and figured I'd go for it. Peppers and preppets, my 1986 Honda VFR 700. Like my other thread I'll chronical what I do and take you along for the ride of restoration! Let the rebuild begin!

(http://i591.photobucket.com/albums/ss352/thewarriorhunter/VFR%20700%20Restoration/0305141659_zpsekdpiit2.jpg)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: gopack84 on March 06, 2014, 10:04:00 AM
Sweet ride! I'm going to have to follow this thread. I worked at a Honda dealership in college as a service writer and one of the mechanics had the F2 version of this bike when it was brand new. The white one with the gold decals. Will be interesting to follow along.

Is it running now or are you going to have to dig into the engine mechanicals? Good luck with the restoration!
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 06, 2014, 11:19:41 AM
The guy i bought it from said it was running, then it got rained on when the carbs were off and the engine got flooded so it doesn't right now, which is why i got it for so cheap ($200). This is the F1 version, i just ordered the honda factory service manual for it, once that comes in I'll really start to dig into the engine.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Zef_66 on March 06, 2014, 11:51:09 AM
Very nice.

First thing I would do if you plan on trying to use the engine that came with it is drain the oil and gas. And let it drain for awhile. Several days to two weeks. You could even pour some fresh gas/oil through each system and let them drains again. Let all that water get out. Then I would pour some tranny fluid all through the engine and let it drain again. This will coat the inside and lubricate it when you try to start it. Even put a liberal amount (a cup or so) down each spark plug hole and let it drain.

Then button everything back up. New oil filter, new oil, new fuel filter (if there isn't one, put one in line somewhere), new fuel (wouldn't hurt to mix a little 2 stroke oil in with the gas in a ratio of 200:1 or so), etc. Make sure the battery is completely charged, or even leave the charger on it, and try to start it. Use some starting fluid if necessary. Hopefully you can get it running and won't be too much of an issue. It will smoke a bit from all the messing around you will do. But it should clear up. Then run it a couple miles and change the fluids and filters again.

I was asked to sell a bike that had been sitting in a wet basement for a bunch of years. The motor was locked up. But doing the above, I got it running just fine and put over 60 miles on it with no problems before I sold it.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Joseph Seal on March 06, 2014, 06:47:41 PM
does the motor turn over?
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 08, 2014, 06:52:36 PM
My vfr holy bible showed up, it even smells like a shop!

(http://i591.photobucket.com/albums/ss352/thewarriorhunter/VFR%20700%20Restoration/0308141306_zpsoyjmzija.jpg)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 24, 2014, 02:21:16 PM
well, just finished up some major work on the car and we are settling into a rhythm with the new baby, hopefully in a week or two i will be able to start taking the bike apart and working on it.

while looking around at parts and vfr info i came across a guy who found one for $300 on craigslist and ended up taking it to the salt flats to race, pretty cool stuff: http://www.motogeo.com/vfr750-%E2%80%9986-build-project-%E2%80%98rainey%E2%80%99/
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: backwoods_engineer on April 01, 2014, 05:31:08 PM
:popcorn:
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on April 20, 2014, 10:26:50 PM
well, not that it matters for the bike actually running, but i found a couple of the body pieces that i needed cheap on craigslist. now, that craigslist happened to be in LA... and i'm in tucson, but the guy is really nice and i'm trusting him to ship them to me. they should ship out monday! i was going to start tearing the bike down this weekend but  i had a coolant leak that needed to be fixed on my truck  (http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=45154.msg559243#msg559243). that is done... so maybe sometime this week i can get to it.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on April 28, 2014, 08:28:45 AM
woohoo! finally got to start tearing the bike apart. got the handlebars and front cowl/headlight off. as i take more off i find more parts that are broken  >:( but i guess that is to be expected with a bike this old, and even more so with one that was dropped. i took a bunch of pictures and will try to get them uploaded later today so this can be a proper rebuild thread.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Veritas on April 28, 2014, 08:38:08 AM
 :popcorn: :popcorn:
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on April 28, 2014, 09:48:45 AM
let there be pictures! i'm probably just going to post them up and answer any questions if you fine folks have them. when i get to rebuilding i might get more detailed but there is so much going on that i think the pictures can speak for themselves. also i am trying a new image hosting site, imgur. i'll post the album link with each update starting on the first picture posted. i am putting more pictures there than here, and i'm also putting notes/descriptions on them, mostly for myself. i thought that by doing this i'll be able to remember things later on when i start putting things back together.

album link: http://imgur.com/a/OCiBf#0

(http://i.imgur.com/Blm0UsS.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/BF1lyud.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/I1JR0ZK.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/BwrFkEq.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/BaSf1dF.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/YLILeLt.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/B0eEbZP.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/XjlV1j2.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/fE2QwEd.jpg)

END DAY 1 - Front cowl, headlight, and handlebars are removed:

(http://i.imgur.com/FoKkUdQ.jpg)


Also, here's a question. Any good methods for keeping nuts/bolts/screws that lose their homes during this process organized and accounted for? The best thing I can think of is to tape them to some paper and label them, like the picture shows. If you have another idea please share!

(http://i.imgur.com/nvZZajU.jpg)


Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: ChrisFox on April 28, 2014, 10:03:29 AM
I used to use egg cartons. Now I just use zip lock bags/masking tape to label and a few Stanley Fatmax organizers.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: ncjeeper on April 28, 2014, 10:45:18 AM
Use ziplock bags and write on the outside with a sharpe whats inside.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Zef_66 on April 28, 2014, 10:46:32 AM
When I rebuilt my tranny, I used snack sized zip lock bags and a sharpie marker. Worked great.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on April 28, 2014, 11:12:47 AM
looks like bags are the winner! guess i'll go get a box of the snack sized bags, those will be perfect for this.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: desmond11 on April 28, 2014, 11:26:25 AM
I use the formentioned Ziploc bag and sharpie method,but when it comes to bolts or screws that have to go in a certain order,I get a small piece of cardboard stab the bolts through the cardboard and make a diagram of the corresponding places and order in which they go back.then put cardboard with bolts in a Ziploc.looks like it should be a fun project.I am bobbering out a Yamaha Virgo 550 right now.good luck
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on April 28, 2014, 04:28:23 PM
I use the formentioned Ziploc bag and sharpie method,but when it comes to bolts or screws that have to go in a certain order,I get a small piece of cardboard stab the bolts through the cardboard and make a diagram of the corresponding places and order in which they go back.then put cardboard with bolts in a Ziploc.looks like it should be a fun project.I am bobbering out a Yamaha Virgo 550 right now.good luck

good luck to you too! i'm not a fan of the bobber look, but i guess that's why there are so many different types of bikes!
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: archer on April 28, 2014, 05:20:44 PM
good start!
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on April 28, 2014, 10:47:48 PM
so... type 1 error time! not sure where my mind was but for some reason i had it in my head that my bike only had about a liter of oil in it... if you have a great way to clean up oil stains/residue i'm all ears:

my new 'Oops!' album for mistakes: http://imgur.com/a/tCZRX (http://imgur.com/a/tCZRX)

(http://i.imgur.com/i09ZiWJ.jpg?1)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: desmond11 on April 29, 2014, 05:39:11 AM
Cat litter work very well,also saw dust works but not as well as the cat litter. Sprinkle c.l. over oil and let it soak up oil may need two applications.let sit over night sweep up next day.a small stain will be left ,you can power wash it off,or degrease it.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on April 29, 2014, 09:39:24 AM
yup, cat litter is what i used, good thing i'm a prepper and have a lot of it on hand! i'll have to apply more this evening, was to tired last night after the initial clean up and didn't have time this morning
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: ncjeeper on April 29, 2014, 08:06:14 PM
Its not a real garage until you get your first oil spill.  :D
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on April 29, 2014, 09:30:00 PM
Well, I can check that of the list then!
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Zef_66 on April 30, 2014, 11:37:21 AM
Cat litter works well. Put it down, and even grind some into the stain with your foot. Then sweep up.

On smoother floors, you can use brake cleaner. Spray on and scrub and then wipe off with rags.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: fzrspirit on April 30, 2014, 07:53:25 PM
Great thread!

It really brings me back to 2006 when I bought a Honda CBR1000F Hurricane that wasn't running. I sold it after I got it running though--turned out to be a weird vacuum leak.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 02, 2014, 09:55:42 PM
got the front end 98% removed today. only the ignition is still hanging on.

album start for new pictures: http://imgur.com/a/OCiBf#26 (http://imgur.com/a/OCiBf#26)

utilizing the cardboard idea mentioned:

(http://i.imgur.com/kyViD84.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/zRO0S5C.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/83YNZMR.jpg)

lesson learned:

(http://i.imgur.com/r0bHuNu.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/AwgXUQg.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/GhHLJix.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/GhHLJix.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/yTVT2l5.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/QvdFlpm.jpg)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: gopack84 on May 02, 2014, 11:28:52 PM
Man this thread is bringing back some memories. I worked as a service writer in a Honda dealership part time in college. Got to ride lots of great stuff. Never did see so many 600cc sport bikes with road rash. I had no idea there was that much sand on the road around Raleigh NC.   ;D We made a small fortune in repairing those things. There was a big markup on ABS plastic in the late 1980's

I need to go find me a bike somewhere.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 02, 2014, 11:52:37 PM

I need to go find me a bike somewhere.

That is what i did! Tearing it apart had been fun and educational.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: ncjeeper on May 03, 2014, 01:01:33 PM
I worked as a service writer in a Honda dealership part time in college.
The one on Hwy 70?
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: gopack84 on May 05, 2014, 07:04:10 AM
The one on Hwy 70?

That was nearly 25 years ago and clouded by college induced haze. ;) I want to say it was on the North side of Raleigh somewhere near Atlantic Avenue/Capital Blvd area. I don't think it's in the same location now. I know to get there from the NCSU side of town, I'd take Wade Ave in towards downtown, then get on Capital Blvd north and make a few other turns but they've re-sculpted so much of that area now I can't tell from google maps what used to be what. And Crabtree Creek ran nearby there because I remember a Biscuitville nearby that we used to eat at occasionally and the creek ran right beside it. I can still find that on the map! It didn't take much to flood that creek. I could probably find it given a little time to drive around. I think the owner lived in/near Garner. We sold Sea-Doo's and woodstoves at the time too.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 05, 2014, 11:16:50 AM
More stuff removed! Clutch, most of the coolant system, and more of the wiring harness has been removed:

Album start for this series: http://imgur.com/a/OCiBf#50 (http://imgur.com/a/OCiBf#50)

Fuse box and ignition coming off:

(http://i.imgur.com/HBCJyoM.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/jvIeZ0Z.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/aKK2Kfn.jpg)

Clutch:

(http://i.imgur.com/2APEfgo.jpg)

Coolant System:

(http://i.imgur.com/Ncl26nw.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/0bFJcKC.jpg)

This bike never seems to fun out of fluids...

(http://i.imgur.com/r67EgpM.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/KrSCkKv.jpg)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: archer on May 05, 2014, 11:48:06 AM
oh so that is where the fuses are. never found them on my old Suzuki..
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 05, 2014, 10:19:22 PM
Got more done this evening, the above post was actually from the other night. I wish I could spend all day working on this.

Album start: http://imgur.com/a/OCiBf#71

Radiator and fan:

(http://i.imgur.com/LGo0L1j.jpg)

This was hanging off the bike when I got it, I think it's part of the fuel line. I think I'm looking at a fuel pump and filter:

(http://i.imgur.com/1V1wVpL.jpg)

Coolant reservoir is out, and the plastic baggy method for small parts/screws/etc is great, thanks for the tip guys!

(http://i.imgur.com/ioSjkmV.jpg)

Ignition coils for the rear head... I think... I'm pretty sure... they connect to the spark plugs, my wordage might be wrong:

(http://i.imgur.com/UToUlgt.jpg)

Keeping a photo record of parts and wires. I have a wiring diagram but I'm sure every little bit will help:

(http://i.imgur.com/UcyaCSj.jpg)

Bracket removed!

(http://i.imgur.com/VPp8UAO.jpg)

Today's harvest. The box next to the parts is getting full, about time to get another one ready:

(http://i.imgur.com/Lz1pU9T.jpg)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: ChrisFox on May 06, 2014, 12:09:14 PM
So jealous right now. I haven't wrenched on a project car since I was right out of high school. 1984 Camaro that I took the engine out and stuck in a 383. I may have to creep on Craigslist and find me some old 4 door sedan from the 70's.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 07, 2014, 09:05:23 AM
Today you will meet... Chopper Street Bike!

Album start: http://imgur.com/a/OCiBf#97

Foot pegs are coming off:

(http://i.imgur.com/ffluQOR.jpg)

Removed, along with a random wire... not sure where its home is:

(http://i.imgur.com/7mSG7qA.jpg)

Upper frame is off:

(http://i.imgur.com/liUhaSj.jpg)

And here she is! CHOPPER STREET BIKE!

(http://i.imgur.com/UOBirCg.jpg)

It's about to get real detailed and intricate now... time to slow down and really pay attention to what I'm doing:

(http://i.imgur.com/YVmP3TI.jpg)


So the good news is that I am able to turn the engine about 95% in a complete rotation. I can visibly see the rods moving in a couple of the openings, but I can also see what looks like rust. I'm sure that's from when it got flooded. Hopefully once I get into it I'll be able to clean it up and get it running again, if not the bike is getting parted out and I'll have to start over...
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 07, 2014, 09:42:09 PM
So... got some of the clutch parts removed, and then ran into a snag. I need a special tool to remove a lock nut from the inside of the clutch, and don't really want to shell out $50+ for this one tool. I've asked around some bike forum to see if someone has one I can borrow.

Here's some photos of the little progress that was made:

Now you see it:

(http://i.imgur.com/5Uaf0ON.jpg)

Now you don't:

(http://i.imgur.com/EtfNfIZ.jpg)

Parts removed and placed down in the order they came off:

(http://i.imgur.com/wbSouTZ.jpg)

And here's the problem:

(http://i.imgur.com/IQXwhkF.jpg)

The nut is staked and I need a special Honda 26 x 30mm spanner wrench to remove it... of all the times to be reminded of an AR 15... so if anyone happens to have Honda tool 07716-0020203 lying around their shop, I'll pay for postage to ship it to me and I promise to send it back!
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: ncjeeper on May 07, 2014, 11:56:24 PM
I did an Ebay search for you but only could find 20x24mm wrenches.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 08, 2014, 08:51:09 AM
I did an Ebay search for you but only could find 20x24mm wrenches.

yup, i did find one at an obscure website  here  (http://dratv.stores.yahoo.net/clutnuttool4.html). it might work, but i'm not sure since it's not specific to my bike. i think i'm going to go to HF today and pick up an angle grinder and grind down a socket to fit. i've seen a couple DIY posts where guys did this and it worked. plus it will add a tool to my toobox that i have wanted, there's been several times in the past where having one would have been nice, and HF has them for 9.99 after a coupon... so same price and i get it NOW!
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Zef_66 on May 08, 2014, 10:10:44 AM
Times like that, I love working where I do. I can just draw up in CAD whatever I need, and have it laser cut out of sheet metal in no time. Or weld something together. Metal shops are great for stuff like that.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 08, 2014, 08:48:09 PM
So are you offering to make me stuff or just gloating?  ;)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 09, 2014, 10:46:08 PM
Victory is mine! Pics tomorrow.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 10, 2014, 09:27:22 AM
Pics of my glorious victory! I bought a socket and an angle grinder.

Marking the socket:

(http://i.imgur.com/cLsvNsq.jpg)

I think my next tool will be a vice...

(http://i.imgur.com/D79jOJt.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/n6RndAE.jpg)

More special tools needed? A clutch lock and gear stopper? I think I have those lying around here somewhere...

(http://i.imgur.com/f5Ad4EZ.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/WbgYTHx.jpg)

Victory!

(http://i.imgur.com/BzzOF17.jpg)

The nut that was the problem is the one next to the end of the rod:

(http://i.imgur.com/l2k7ad4.jpg)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Greekman on May 11, 2014, 12:42:54 AM
hurah for DIY!
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Zef_66 on May 12, 2014, 10:11:44 AM
So are you offering to make me stuff or just gloating?  ;)

Mainly just gloating. :-D

But really, if you need something small, shoot me a message and we can talk about it. It's usually not to much hassle to get something cut.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: archer on May 12, 2014, 11:38:08 AM
good job!
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 12, 2014, 11:47:24 AM
Mainly just gloating. :-D

But really, if you need something small, shoot me a message and we can talk about it. It's usually not to much hassle to get something cut.

That's so cool of you to offer that. I may need a small part or two fabricated during the rebuild, not sure.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 13, 2014, 08:31:20 AM
Got most of the exhaust off last night. There are still two pipes that come out of the rear of the engine but I can't remove those until I either drop the engine or remove the swing arm and rear shock... not sure which way to go yet.

(http://i.imgur.com/N7LMs1X.jpg)

The inside of the pipes where they connect was nasty and rusted out:

(http://i.imgur.com/HUgqw6r.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/UaVgVZ7.jpg)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 20, 2014, 05:13:57 PM
Lot's more done and getting close to dropping the engine!

All of this is coming off:

(http://i.imgur.com/e5RlvZf.jpg)

Not sure how long this bike sat... but spider webs and dead ants were everywhere!

(http://i.imgur.com/UDx1ToG.jpg)

Alternator flywheel and stator removed:

(http://i.imgur.com/k8ykCsh.jpg)

Oil pan off, I can see through the engine! Really impressed with how well the inside of the engine looks. Most components look brand new still which is encouraging:

(http://i.imgur.com/Y098ZLY.jpg)

This all came out:

(http://i.imgur.com/jGTY7nh.jpg)

Kickstand is off. It's up to the jack to hold until I drop the engine:

(http://i.imgur.com/AmVskf5.jpg)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: archer on May 20, 2014, 06:07:02 PM
keep going!
i want to see you get it all back together and not have leftover parts.... ;)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 20, 2014, 09:03:16 PM
keep going!
i want to see you get it all back together and not have leftover parts.... ;)

I know... I had a small ring fall out last night from underneath... I'm not really sure where it goes, but I have an idea. I'm going to try and figure that out tonight.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: archer on May 21, 2014, 08:19:45 AM
good luck!
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 21, 2014, 08:27:00 AM
You really need to quit changing your name... here I am thinking I had a new person interested in my rebuild...
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: archer on May 22, 2014, 08:09:32 AM
You really need to quit changing your name... here I am thinking I had a new person interested in my rebuild...
haha ;) maybe in a few weeks when things get calmed down i'll go back to archer.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: pokeshell on May 24, 2014, 02:12:32 AM
You really need to quit changing your name... here I am thinking I had a new person interested in my rebuild...


Watching from the shadows.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 24, 2014, 10:08:30 AM
Getting close!

Album start: http://imgur.com/a/OCiBf#163

Wheels, frame, and engine are all that's left:

(http://i.imgur.com/h7DPFjW.jpg)

Front wheel off:

(http://i.imgur.com/M2bPkXu.jpg)

Forks removed:

(http://i.imgur.com/39oXY3k.jpg)

More special tool time!

(http://i.imgur.com/HgrmjZY.jpg)

Rear wheel removed:

(http://i.imgur.com/bsz7Oqw.jpg)

Swing arm off:

(http://i.imgur.com/hpeIcop.jpg)

Almost there. The frame bolts were really sticking and I may have stripped one. I'm going to hit them with PB blaster for a day or two and try again.

(http://i.imgur.com/SsaX4eM.jpg)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on May 26, 2014, 10:36:11 AM
So I did completely round off one of the bolts. A quick Google search and I learned about bolt out sockets. They grab rounded bolts as you remove them:

(http://i.imgur.com/fbGiRfg.jpg)

Worked great, and you can see why that bolt stuck so bad:

(http://i.imgur.com/JjETQv6.jpg)

Frame is off and engine is on the workbench ready for phase 2:

(http://i.imgur.com/W0Tocil.jpg)

If you want to go through the whole album of 193 pictures it is here: http://imgur.com/a/OCiBf#0
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on June 27, 2014, 11:43:38 AM
Wow, can't believe I haven't touched this for over a month. I got to tear down one of the heads last night and took a look at what I have to work with:

Took the other head cover off and started to match up bolts with the ones I had since the guy before me removed one size but didn't mark anything. Here's just the cover off so you can see the difference in both sides:

(http://i.imgur.com/3UPoZQi.jpg)

Cam shafts before removal (and more bolt matching):

(http://i.imgur.com/4dk3ghL.jpg)

Cam shafts out:

(http://i.imgur.com/SUXjjFK.jpg)

And here's the damage, some rust on the drive gear:

(http://i.imgur.com/T5Su2Uq.jpg)

Underside of the head:

(http://i.imgur.com/tAFDu0J.jpg)

And piston chambers:

(http://i.imgur.com/Cnjhkn8.jpg)

I took the upper head to a shop and showed them some other pictures. They think it's not too bad but there's still a lot of unknowns since i don't have the valves off yet. There is a special tool in my way that I am currently trying to source to get the valve springs removed.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on July 06, 2014, 11:13:45 PM
Got one head completely disassembled the other night. I think I used over 20 baggies to keep all of the parts separate and labeled.

I was waiting on a valve spring compressor. Got it for $13.51 off ebay. The seller messed up so I got my shipping refunded but had to wait a few extra days for it to arrive:

(https://i.imgur.com/hlVx4OA.jpg)

I labeled some card board and printed this picture out then further labeled it to keep each individual part accounted for. This will also allow me to reinstall everything in the exact spot it came out of:

(https://i.imgur.com/Dg7sYKc.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/CHJ8Kza.jpg)

Compressor in action:

(https://i.imgur.com/iyBlIoI.jpg)

One down... seven to go!

(https://i.imgur.com/NZx3L17.jpg)

This was one of the intake valves... yuck! I am encouraged though that the rim is so shiny and not corroded. I'm hoping the valves will all sit nicely against the chambers.

(https://i.imgur.com/m8JO2RR.jpg)

Dirty...

(https://i.imgur.com/Epsc6C2.jpg)

This head is done!

(https://i.imgur.com/iKPACN3.jpg)

With that said I'm getting the point that I need to start cleaning these parts and seeing what I have. I have read about boiling parts in water, boiling in lemon juice, or just dipping in carb cleaner. Any recommended methods for cleaning this type of stuff up? I'm planning on buying a stock pot large enough to fit each individual piece if I go the boiling route and seeing if my grill's side burner will do the job. Pretty sure my wife would kill me if I tried to boil this off inside.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: ChrisFox on July 07, 2014, 12:02:40 AM
I don't know if you can get away with it or not but a few years ago I cleaned out an aluminum head off a straight six in the dishwasher using a non sudsy cleaner. It took a few times but it came out looking ok. We hit it with walnut shells out of a sandblaster first because we had some lying around.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on July 07, 2014, 09:23:51 AM
Pretty sure that would get me no lovin' for a long time... although she does work some days and I'm home with the kids by myself...
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 18, 2015, 08:22:17 AM
Zombie time, reviving this thread! I cannot believe it's been this long since I've touched this engine, but life happens. I am going to start designating Tuesday nights as my 'bike night' since I'm usually working on school all day. It's a good way to wind down and it puts time on the calendar for getting this done.

I got the front head off last night and started working on the transmission. Of the three bolts holding the bearing bracket two of the heads sheared off... not too happy about that. I guess the best way to remove them will be to drill a hole and use one of those special extraction bits?

I got about 75% of the crank case bolts out, but there are some larger ones on the bottom that were really stuck. I hit them with some PB Blaster and will do that for the next week. It also doesn't help that the engine is upside down and leverage is not really working for me since the engine is wobbling around.

(http://i.imgur.com/YxPfpLw.jpg)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: archer on March 18, 2015, 09:08:39 AM
good luck/skill!
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: kckndrgn on March 18, 2015, 09:23:12 AM
I got the front head off last night and started working on the transmission. Of the three bolts holding the bearing bracket two of the heads sheared off... not too happy about that. I guess the best way to remove them will be to drill a hole and use one of those special extraction bits?
You can try, I've never had much luck with them.  Try soaking the broken bolts in PB Blaster and using heat on the body (not too much).  Sometime heating/cooling can break the stuck bolts free.

I got about 75% of the crank case bolts out, but there are some larger ones on the bottom that were really stuck. I hit them with some PB Blaster and will do that for the next week. It also doesn't help that the engine is upside down and leverage is not really working for me since the engine is wobbling around.

Never fun working with an unstable piece. Try rigging up some wood to make a solid base.  Having it wobble around may be asking for trouble.  Try using some heat on the stuck bolts as well, usually works for me.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 18, 2015, 11:13:31 AM
You can try, I've never had much luck with them.  Try soaking the broken bolts in PB Blaster and using heat on the body (not too much).  Sometime heating/cooling can break the stuck bolts free.

Never fun working with an unstable piece. Try rigging up some wood to make a solid base.  Having it wobble around may be asking for trouble.  Try using some heat on the stuck bolts as well, usually works for me.

I'll try the PB Blaster after I get the gears out, I don't want to soak the bearings in that stuff. Also the heads are gone... so the heat is probably a good idea coupled with the extractors... not sure how else I would get them out.

And I do have some wood scraps around that I'm going to try and do something with, I don't feel like hurting myself or dropping the engine on my foot.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 18, 2015, 11:39:40 PM
Put the engine on it's side tonight and got all but two of the bolts loose. The last two are stubborn and leverage is difficult. I bought a heat gun to see if hitting it with that will help. Should arrive Friday so maybe Saturday I can give it a shot.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: kckndrgn on March 19, 2015, 07:26:10 AM
I've always just used a propane torch, just being careful not to over heat the area.

If push comes to shove on the broken bolts, taking it to the a good machine shop or repair center and have them drill out and tap the holes.  I've had to do that before.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 19, 2015, 03:05:25 PM
With the bits of oil still in there I'd be very hesitant to use a torch.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 23, 2015, 08:27:48 AM
So after a steady diet of heat, PB Blaster, and some gentle tapping with a hammer and wood, I have gotten all of the bolts loose except one that won't budge. I've broken one socket and am close to either breaking a second or stripping the bolt head and I really don't want to do that.

Any other ideas?

I am really thinking I may need an impact wrench to break the bolt loose. Any reason why I shouldn't do this?
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: kckndrgn on March 23, 2015, 08:33:00 AM
I would try the impact wrench, nothing to loose really.

Have you tried using a "cheater" bar to get more leverage on the socket?  Been several times just adding a about 2' of pipe to the handle on the socket handle gave me the extra umph needed.

I know on my current build project the impact wrench has come in quite handy, so nothing wrong with "needing" to add a new tool to the tool box.   ;D
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 23, 2015, 09:44:52 AM
I'd love to buy one, but I just bought a new socket set since I broke the one and it was am excuse/reason to get deep sockets as well (I do need to get the spark plugs out after all). I have been using an 18" breaker bar and that is what got all the other bolts out.

I have a few friends with them, or I may see if the auto store rents them. I know years ago my dad rented an impact wrench. I could pick it up after work, break that bolt loose and then take it back the next day.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Carl on March 23, 2015, 04:57:12 PM
How about a IMPACT DRIVER that is hit with a hammer rather than air driven?

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000NPPATS/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_dp_ss_1?pf_rd_p=1944687662&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B0006V2GPU&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=1R7GYES0TAFQQTMWZZW7
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: kckndrgn on March 23, 2015, 07:14:36 PM
Well now, that's an interesting tool.  Might come in handy in an emergency.  Adding it to my wish list.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: ChrisFox on March 23, 2015, 10:42:50 PM
Stuck bolts are the bane of any wrench turner. Last job I was on, we had a 1 inch drive breaker bar and a 12 foot cheater pipe. One good heave to and finally got it to move.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Carl on March 23, 2015, 11:11:02 PM
Stuck bolts are the bane of any wrench turner. Last job I was on, we had a 1 inch drive breaker bar and a 12 foot cheater pipe. One good heave to and finally got it to move.

The bolt ,or the vehicle MOVED?  :)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Greekman on March 24, 2015, 02:07:09 AM
How about a IMPACT DRIVER that is hit with a hammer rather than air driven?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000NPPATS/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_dp_ss_1?pf_rd_p=1944687662&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B0006V2GPU&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=1R7GYES0TAFQQTMWZZW7

its use is d efacto when removing car door hinges from the frame. infact i did that when reclaiming the doors of a beater for my almost Antique former car

Stuck bolts are the bane of any wrench turner. Last job I was on, we had a 1 inch drive breaker bar and a 12 foot cheater pipe. One good heave to and finally got it to move.

hmmm that much torque...Can the bolt edges bear it?
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 24, 2015, 09:43:58 AM
Carl that is great! I didn't know they made manual drivers and that is perfect for me. I couldn't find a rental anywhere and was seriously considering buying an electric one, using it nicely for the one bolt, and returning it. This is a much better option and doesn't make me get into a moral gray area.

They've even got a half inch drive for a few bucks less, and I have some really nice Tekton impact adapters so I think I'll be going with that one. The socket set I just ordered was Tekton as well. For the shade tree mechanic like myself I think they are great tools. I only wish I'd known about this tool a few days ago so I could have it today. Tuesday are my bike day so this might have to get put off...

So close and yet so far... :(
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Carl on March 24, 2015, 09:56:10 AM
Carl that is great! I didn't know they made manual drivers and that is perfect for me. I couldn't find a rental anywhere and was seriously considering buying an electric one, using it nicely for the one bolt, and returning it. This is a much better option and doesn't make me get into a moral gray area.

They've even got a half inch drive for a few bucks less, and I have some really nice Tekton impact adapters so I think I'll be going with that one. The socket set I just ordered was Tekton as well. For the shade tree mechanic like myself I think they are great tools. I only wish I'd known about this tool a few days ago so I could have it today. Tuesday are my bike day so this might have to get put off...

So close and yet so far... :(

The 'shock' from the hammer and spin it imparts are maybe not as fast as an air -impact but it has worked for me as I got,and still have,my first one after about 40 years...it has saved my beans a number of times. It does take a bit of room for hammer swing but it is very effective.

I added an image that you ,and others may find helpful...I can't give credit 'cause I don't know where it came from.

(http://i1167.photobucket.com/albums/q639/kb5wmy/Penetrating_Oil_zpskm4yn3ca.jpg) (http://s1167.photobucket.com/user/kb5wmy/media/Penetrating_Oil_zpskm4yn3ca.jpg.html)
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 24, 2015, 09:59:40 AM
Nice, looks like I'm about to be a chemist!
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: ncjeeper on March 24, 2015, 12:37:00 PM
I have been using that 50/50 penetrating mix for awhile now also.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: gopack84 on March 24, 2015, 01:16:48 PM
My dad was a career mechanic in a plant that made household C/D/AA type batteries. In fact, I remember when they brought the AA production line up but I digress.

He always had a manual impact driver like that. In fact it's sitting in my garage now because he gave me most of his tool set when he retired. He had said that thing was a life saver (or at least a knuckle saver) on many occasions.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Carl on March 24, 2015, 02:27:53 PM
I have been using that 50/50 penetrating mix for awhile now also.

Is your jeep an example?
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: ChrisFox on March 24, 2015, 09:37:14 PM
The bolt ,or the vehicle MOVED?  :)

It was a 44mm bolt for the footer on a amusement ride that had the salt air of the Gulf on it for 3 years. It took some talking to. 
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 27, 2015, 10:03:54 AM
Well... the manual driver came in and I tried it out. Tool feels solid and I like it, but that bolt wouldn't budge... I'm really at a loss now of what to do... I guess the next step would be an electric or air impact wrench?
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: kckndrgn on March 27, 2015, 10:36:25 AM
Well, did you see if anyplace had a rental on the impact wrench?  If I were local you could use mine (and the compressor if needed :) ).

Maybe an option would be to find a garage or mechanic and take the engine to them and have them remove that stubborn bolt?

I know on my rebuild of my ATV, it took several tries with the impact wrench to get a bolt off of the pinion gear. When it finally came free I was scared to look thinking the bolt/gear sheared off instead of the bolt coming free.

Good luck
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 27, 2015, 10:41:08 AM
Well, did you see if anyplace had a rental on the impact wrench?  If I were local you could use mine (and the compressor if needed :) ).

Maybe an option would be to find a garage or mechanic and take the engine to them and have them remove that stubborn bolt?

I know on my rebuild of my ATV, it took several tries with the impact wrench to get a bolt off of the pinion gear. When it finally came free I was scared to look thinking the bolt/gear sheared off instead of the bolt coming free.

Good luck

I already checked rentals and there are none at the auto stores (those are usually free). Home Depot might, I'm going to check there, but I live far enough away that a rental fee + return trip usually equals close to the cost of a tool. I wish I knew someone with a wrench. I've thought about taking the engine to a shop, I may go that route now that this hasn't worked... Oh well, another tool in the box at least.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: ncjeeper on March 27, 2015, 12:24:33 PM
Any pawn shops around you. You might be able to pick an impact cheap that way. Heck you could use it and then pawn it back to then if you really wanted to.  :D
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on March 27, 2015, 01:56:13 PM
Pawn shops are around, just not too many on my side of town.

I stopped by a bike dealership/service center today. The service manager is really cool and I spoke to him last year when I started the project. When I mentioned the bike he remembered me. He said I'm more than welcome to bring the engine case by and have them give it a go with their tools. That's great because I was going to take it by there anyways and have them look over the cylinders and pistons so I can kill two birds with one stone this way.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: kckndrgn on March 27, 2015, 03:09:19 PM
I stopped by a bike dealership/service center today. The service manager is really cool and I spoke to him last year when I started the project. When I mentioned the bike he remembered me. He said I'm more than welcome to bring the engine case by and have them give it a go with their tools. That's great because I was going to take it by there anyways and have them look over the cylinders and pistons so I can kill two birds with one stone this way.

Awesome news!
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on April 06, 2015, 01:12:35 PM
well... sadly the project is dead. pistons are shot and all cylinders need to be re-bored... too cost prohibitive at this point to do anything. Looks like I'm parting it out.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: kckndrgn on April 06, 2015, 01:19:02 PM
well... sadly the project is dead. pistons are shot and all cylinders need to be re-bored... too cost prohibitive at this point to do anything. Looks like I'm parting it out.

 :(  well that sucks.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on April 06, 2015, 10:35:36 PM
:(  well that sucks.

Yeah, but I've already sold the front tire/rim and left mirror for $80 so... looks like I'm going to be making some money off of this. It will probably end up being more than enough to cover the bike and tools I bought along the way, so I'm a happy guy.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Zef_66 on April 07, 2015, 10:04:49 AM
Yeah, but I've already sold the front tire/rim and left mirror for $80 so... looks like I'm going to be making some money off of this. It will probably end up being more than enough to cover the bike and tools I bought along the way, so I'm a happy guy.

And you learned a lot. So even if you lost money on it, the learning experience is good.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on April 07, 2015, 10:30:56 AM
And you learned a lot. So even if you lost money on it, the learning experience is good.

Which is what I planned for. If I were to sign up for a shop class at the local community college I'd probably have spent close to $200 after fees, gas, and time driving there. This way I got to do it on my own time, I did learn a lot, and I got a few new tools out of the deal as well.

While I'm disappointing that I won't get to see it running it is a relief to know where it stands, know that I can help other bikers get parts for this bike, and free up some space in my garage.

The way this has already gone though I think I'm going to make money. $80 from one guy for two parts, another guy wants the seat for $50 plus a few other parts that I have to find and get a price for. I may have a new hobby of buying project bikes, breaking them down and selling off the parts.
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: Carl on April 07, 2015, 10:42:40 AM
Which is what I planned for. If I were to sign up for a shop class at the local community college I'd probably have spent close to $200 after fees, gas, and time driving there. This way I got to do it on my own time, I did learn a lot, and I got a few new tools out of the deal as well.

While I'm disappointing that I won't get to see it running it is a relief to know where it stands, know that I can help other bikers get parts for this bike, and free up some space in my garage.

The way this has already gone though I think I'm going to make money. $80 from one guy for two parts, another guy wants the seat for $50 plus a few other parts that I have to find and get a price for. I may have a new hobby of buying project bikes, breaking them down and selling off the parts.

Don't forget scrap value of what is left..
Title: Re: 1986 Honda VFR 700 Rebuild
Post by: theBINKYhunter on April 28, 2015, 08:49:59 PM
Well, I've made back my initial expense and have plenty of bike left to go. Sold close to $275 worth of stuff and I have a guy coming down this weekend to take most of the rest away for $350. He doesn't need the frame or the engine and I think I can probably get between $200-300 for those parts, more if I'm patient. Not bad for a $200 initial investment!

Even better is I found a bike for sale cheap since it's not running and the owner isn't a mechanic and doesn't want to mess with it. From the symptoms described I think it's a very easy fix that I could probably take care of in a day. I'm hoping to look at it within the next couple of days. If it's what he say's it is then maybe I'll offer to get this out of his garage so he doesn't have to walk around it anymore.