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Survivalism & Self Sufficiency Topics => Transportation => Topic started by: surfivor on November 19, 2014, 06:09:28 PM

Title: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: surfivor on November 19, 2014, 06:09:28 PM
 This is an idea I got from a guy who has a boat ..

 Suppose you lived in Maine and you had a 27 foot sailboat. Would it make sense and be economical as well as reasonably safe if you could set off on the sailboat in the late summer/early fall and sail down the coast for the winter ? Perhaps you anchor off of the coast in various places, thereby you don't have to pay for a hotel or a campsite at least some of the time. You could anchor in some harbor or inlet and go ashore in a smaller boat. Perhaps you could bring a small folding bicycle. I would bring a surfboard of course.

  If you get down to Florida, the Caribbean, South America, etc, maybe you find someplace of the coast that is not too inhabited, maybe part of some island. You could do some gorilla gardening, pick coconuts, various fruits, citrus or what not; learn what is edible etc ... You could catch fish to eat etc.. maybe even catch some game somehow ... I guess you could bring a bow and arrow .. I think some kinds of pink oyster mushrooms grow like crazy where it is hot as well.

 Obviously there are costs, various hazards and things to be aware of, but it seems like an interesting idea ...

Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Cedar on November 19, 2014, 06:25:30 PM
I know a bunch of people off Vancouver Island in BC who did it for years. Some were Americans, some were Brits.

Cedar
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: endurance on November 19, 2014, 07:34:45 PM
There's been several threads on this and using a sailboat as a BOV.  I love the idea, but some reality checks have been:
The peak of the Atlantic Hurricane Season is August through November 1.
Fresh water storage is finite and you either have to pay to resupply or have an expensive reverse osmosis system which requires fuel to run the generator (or more solar than will fit on a small boat).
There are still plenty of pirates in the Carribean.
Nothing is free in Florida, especially a place to sleep.

I still think it's a viable idea, but I got the impression it would be easier on the left coast due to differences in weather patterns, Coastline, and Baja being more adapted to the drifted lifestyle.

But hell, don't listen to me, I'm as land locked as they come (but my dad was a sailor,  sailed from Lake Erie to Oregon on a 26' Shark with a friend in his 20s, and many vacations involved boats when I was a boy).
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Cedar on November 19, 2014, 07:39:11 PM
And boat repairs are expensive.
Want a free one? http://eugene.craigslist.org/zip/4764789397.html

Cedar
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: soupbone on November 19, 2014, 08:43:17 PM
This thread reminds me of an article I read in a yachting magazine in a doctor's office. It was a [humorous] poll on "Who was sexier, your boat or your Significant Other?" The response I remember was, "I don't know who is sexier, but I do know I've been f###ed by my boat a lot more than I have by my wife!!!"

Lesson learned: There's no such thing as a free lunch. Maintaining a boat, or managing one underway, is no easy matter - especially if you're going long distance cruising. One slight slip and you are in deep trouble. Even such little things as maintaining a watch 24 hrs/day can be almost overwhelming unless you have a trained crew. (More people = more supplies = bigger boat = more maintenance...) This would be especially true in a bug-out scenario when you would be on your own, so to speak. A 27' might not be comfortable - or safe - for ocean cruising, and if you use the Inland Waterway, you could find yourself landlocked. As a peacetime adventure, though, it is intriguing, but you will probably have to purchase your supplies - I don't think there is much "open range" along the Eastern Seaboard.

soupbone
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Ms. Albatross on November 19, 2014, 09:21:28 PM
This thread reminds me of an article I read in a yachting magazine in a doctor's office. It was a [humorous] poll on "Who was sexier, your boat or your Significant Other?" The response I remember was, "I don't know who is sexier, but I do know I've been f###ed by my boat a lot more than I have by my wife!!!"

soupbone

 :spit:
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: surfivor on November 20, 2014, 11:28:18 PM
 I don't know alot on the topic. I asked this guy who seems knowledgable. He said maybe some engine maintenance but unless you hit something repairs should not be too bad and boats retain their value and do not depreciate like cars do.


 If a storm is approaching, you would have to take shelter in a bay or harbor. If the storm is really a bad one, I suppose there is a significant risk .. You would always have to keep a constant eye on the weather and be well aware of all harbors and bays and such places along the coast.

 How much does it cost to go through the panama canal ?

 Suppose you bought a piece of land somewhere a little ways up a tidal river or innlet; you could sail up there from the ocean and anchor off your land and stay there. Since you stay in the boat, you would not need to build any big structure to stay in on the property. The property could be in a floodplain or otherwise problematic for living on, yet using a boat the land could be used for gardening. Possibly some land is cheaper if it has issues of that sort, but could be of use to you if you would stay there in a boat. I picture perhaps such a piece of land up a river a few miles in the Carolinas, Alabama, Texas, Florida, Missisipi, Georgia, or someplace .. sail down there from Maine and stay the winter .. plant sweet potatoes in the spring and sail back to Maine .. come back at the end of the summer to harvest the sweet potatoes. You could grow mushrooms and such as well. Some types of mushrooms might fruit when you are not around so you might have to have a local person in the area that harvests the mushrooms for you and takes care of that and give them some amount of free mushrooms or what not. They dry them out or sell them and you give them their cut. No way to know how many mushrooms they got, but you may get lucky and find someone who is honest etc



There also seems to be possibilities for guerrilla gardening in odd places such as islands or land that is hard to access without a boat etc
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Barton on November 21, 2014, 07:35:47 PM

 Suppose you lived in Maine and you had a 27 foot sailboat. Would it make sense and be economical as well as reasonably safe if you could set off on the sailboat in the late summer/early fall and sail down the coast for the winter ? Perhaps you anchor off of the coast in various places, thereby you don't have to pay for a hotel or a campsite at least some of the time. You could anchor in some harbor or inlet and go ashore in a smaller boat. Perhaps you could bring a small folding bicycle.
 

Been there, done that.  Some of the best memories that my wife and I have.   You may want to check out the Intra Coastal Waterway.  It is an inland route that can take you all the way to Texas.  Cape Hatteras can kick some serious butt and is called the Grave Yard of the Atlantic for a reason.  The ICW bypasses Hatteras.  One would want to gain a fair amount of sailing experience and put the boat through it's paces before venturing alone off shore.

Many municipalities have passed anchoring restrictions that force you to spend money on a mooring or marina slip when spending the night.  I still believe it can be done on the cheap, but realize there is a large group that head south each winter and the free anchorages are crowded.   
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: hutchsteaders on November 21, 2014, 07:58:11 PM
Sounds like a fun time!
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: endurance on November 21, 2014, 08:16:49 PM
I don't know alot on the topic. I asked this guy who seems knowledgable. He said maybe some engine maintenance but unless you hit something repairs should not be too bad and boats retain their value and do not depreciate like cars do.
You know there's an expression commonly shared among boaters, don't you?  A boat is a hole in the water you throw money into. 

It's not just the motor or the generator or the batteries or the mold issues or the sump pumps or the electrical issues or the UV deterioration or the dry rot.  You're taking something and putting it in salt water, a substance that loves to exchange ions, which means corrosion, thus, every metal part is under constant attack.  They're never out of the sun, which means near-constant UV damage.

The fact they last as long as they do is miraculous, but it's at the expense of a lot of time keeping things clean, painted, lubricated, and replaced when they fail.  Fall behind and you're in trouble.  Rudder failure is never a good thing.  Neither are electrical issues that can cause fires due to corrosion on connections.  Keep up on it and you'll be fine.  It's just not "free livin'" like a lot of people dream about. 

Quote
How much does it cost to go through the panama canal ?
He went through in the mid-to-late 60s, so even if he ever mentioned it, it wouldn't be relevant anymore.  I know he went through some locks (either on the Erie Canal or Panama) along side huge cargo ships.  He said he could just see a sliver of sky in along side of them.  His mast didn't even reach the top of the canal at times.

Quote
Suppose you bought a piece of land somewhere a little ways up a tidal river or innlet; you could sail up there from the ocean and anchor off your land and stay there. Since you stay in the boat, you would not need to build any big structure to stay in on the property. The property could be in a floodplain or otherwise problematic for living on, yet using a boat the land could be used for gardening. Possibly some land is cheaper if it has issues of that sort, but could be of use to you if you would stay there in a boat. I picture perhaps such a piece of land up a river a few miles in the Carolinas, Alabama, Texas, Florida, Missisipi, Georgia, or someplace .. sail down there from Maine and stay the winter .. plant sweet potatoes in the spring and sail back to Maine .. come back at the end of the summer to harvest the sweet potatoes. You could grow mushrooms and such as well. Some types of mushrooms might fruit when you are not around so you might have to have a local person in the area that harvests the mushrooms for you and takes care of that and give them some amount of free mushrooms or what not. They dry them out or sell them and you give them their cut. No way to know how many mushrooms they got, but you may get lucky and find someone who is honest etc
Cool idea.  You might even be able to talk someone in to leasing their low, flood-prone land to you for a very reasonable price.

Quote
There also seems to be possibilities for guerrilla gardening in odd places such as islands or land that is hard to access without a boat etc
Yep, but odds are only islands in rivers are going to grow normal crops since salt water intrusion on islands is going to rule out many crops, at least near the shore.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: FreeLancer on November 22, 2014, 12:37:48 AM
You know there's an expression commonly shared among boaters, don't you?  A boat is a hole in the water you throw money into. 

That, and the happiest days of boat ownership are the day it's purchased and the day it's sold. 
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: surfivor on November 23, 2014, 03:33:08 PM

 I know about the outer banks, though it is a popular surf spot. I saw a sailboat wash up on the beach in a storm ..

 It seems these sailboats can only do 5 mph most of the time, so it would take a week or more to go from Maine to Hatteras
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Barton on November 24, 2014, 03:27:30 PM

 It seems these sailboats can only do 5 mph most of the time, so it would take a week or more to go from Maine to Hatteras

We mostly motored on the ICW with our 30 foot sailboat.  Seemed like we were fighting wind and current all the time.  The best day we ever had was 60 miles and that was from sun up to sun down.  We dropped anchor just as it was too dark to see.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: David in MN on November 24, 2014, 04:49:53 PM
While not a sailboat, I've known people who lived on boats on the Mississippi to avoid our winter. River based boat living hasn't been as popular here as in Europe. I wish I still had contact with the distant uncle who lives on a barge, he'd be a good contact for you.

If ocean is a requirement, this midwesterner can't help much.

I've always liked the idea of any mobile home.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: nelson96 on November 24, 2014, 04:57:13 PM
I'm not against the idea, but do find it interesting that this thought of nomadic travel is being accepted much more than what is being discussed on another thread (http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=a4106ddeedcac4429a3c41bdb459f37b&topic=52418.0) here on TSP. 

.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Gamer on December 24, 2014, 03:54:31 AM
I almost bought a small yacht/cabin cruiser some years ago with the aim of living in it permanently on the English waterways system, but although a second-hand one is cheap, there's so much British Waterways Board red tape hassle that I never bothered.
For example an annual "residential licence" costs the earth, and it must be a proper houseboat, otherwise you're not allowed to live on the thing.
Of course, in a post-apocalypse world to hell with licences and stuff, I'd probably get something like this below, paint it in camo stripes and moor up a quiet backwater while the zombs are rioting and eating each other in the cities..

(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/CMSF/river-b.gif)
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: keebler on December 24, 2014, 09:24:14 AM
NOT me-!!--I spent 14 Years at sea in Uncle Sam's Canoe Club, including 5 in NATO, sailed the 7 seas, this is the last thing I would ever do. Around the world, over the top, thru Panama & the Suez canals, met many wonderful people been in 100's of fabulous Ports, more countries than I can still name. My Feet are planted firmly in the boonies of southern Va.
keeb.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: shambo on December 24, 2014, 01:58:09 PM
NOT me-!!--I spent 14 Years at sea in Uncle Sam's Canoe Club, including 5 in NATO, sailed the 7 seas, this is the last thing I would ever do. Around the world, over the top, thru Panama & the Suez canals, met many wonderful people been in 100's of fabulous Ports, more countries than I can still name. My Feet are planted firmly in the boonies of southern Va.
keeb.
Wow!  I would like to talk with you for a couple weeks and hear your stories over a campfire and some quality adult beverages.  Maybe you could post some stories on this forum?
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: keebler on December 25, 2014, 06:49:19 AM
I have plenty camping spots on my land, fire ring, Picnic table, any thing from Tent to Casita camper, camper van, or 35 ft Motorhome. love them all go up there  See the universe & glad to be alive.
keeb. in southern Va. out in the boonies. permanent shore duty.
been here since June 84.
happy & free.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Hiker on January 17, 2015, 07:26:36 PM
This is actually a very timely question.  I am a big fan of Survivalist Scott B. Williams books.  I have read his books 'The Pulse'  and 'Bug Out'.   The scenarios he describes and how people react in them come off as being very realistic as to what would actually happen in those situations.

Williams is big into sailing and sea kayaking and just recently he came out with his new survival novel, 'Sailing the Apocalypse'.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: kmorgan on February 04, 2015, 10:28:27 PM
This is an idea I got from a guy who has a boat ..

 Suppose you lived in Maine and you had a 27 foot sailboat. Would it make sense and be economical as well as reasonably safe if you could set off on the sailboat in the late summer/early fall and sail down the coast for the winter ? Perhaps you anchor off of the coast in various places, thereby you don't have to pay for a hotel or a campsite at least some of the time. You could anchor in some harbor or inlet and go ashore in a smaller boat. Perhaps you could bring a small folding bicycle. I would bring a surfboard of course.

  If you get down to Florida, the Caribbean, South America, etc, maybe you find someplace of the coast that is not too inhabited, maybe part of some island. You could do some gorilla gardening, pick coconuts, various fruits, citrus or what not; learn what is edible etc ... You could catch fish to eat etc.. maybe even catch some game somehow ... I guess you could bring a bow and arrow .. I think some kinds of pink oyster mushrooms grow like crazy where it is hot as well.

 Obviously there are costs, various hazards and things to be aware of, but it seems like an interesting idea ...

I would not recommend just anchoring off "some island off the coast of Florida" those "some islands" are privately owned! How would YOU like some itinerant stranger showing up on your front yard (or beach..) picking the fruit off your trees?? The biggest problem private islanders have seem to be boaters casually arriving at their "front door" and making camp! or just arriving for a day picnic.. I would be furious if that were MY home. This is 2015, not 1715! all those luscious tropical islands belong to someone.

Speaking as someone who HAS lived aboard- if you MUST get a boat, a sailboat is most economical and it is much easier to work on and/or replace a portable outboard motor than a big engine to a motorboat. Plus, if your engine fails- you have sails! Cheapest sailboat/best one in my opinion is an early 1960s fibreglass hull with a deep hull (for sea voyages, get a sea worthy boat- not a freshwater one) there used to be a POS sailboat maker "MacGregor" steer far clear of those. I moved one of those from San Diego to Los Angeles and the boat was SO cheap, I could feel the hull twist and turn out of shape with the pull and push of the waves at sea. It terrified me- it was such a piece of literal crap. As I sailed it pieces of it fell apart! Get a good well made, sturdy boat, just ask around or read forums on which one to buy. Buying a boat is like buying a horse: when you want one, you can't find one cheap- but when you HAVE one, you'll find a thousand people ready and willing to give one away for free. You also have to figure in regular $$$$$ for maintenance that cannot be ignored: painting the hull, etc etc upkeep on all sorts of odds and ends. Can you dive? you're going to need all kinds of skills to be a good sailor or pay someone the big bucks to perform basic repairs or even just to dive to retrieve your irreplaceable set of keys you dropped in the marina. Sailing is a skill. If you are a green horn it will show and obviously to other sailors and it can be a rather snobbish clicque-y group.

HOW TO FIND A GREAT BOAT SUPER CHEAP: Visit any marina (in CALIF try Newport Beach, Long Beach, etc I am not too sure on what's going on on East coast- there are plenty in FL that are not hard to find!) and even go out on a small boat to check out all the FOR SALE signs on boats that are on moorings (out on the water) as opposed to one's anchored in the marina. The moored ones way out in the water will go for a cheaper price as their owners may be more desperate: divorced men (hahah if they haven't made their old boat their new bachelor apartment!), or newly married men! who have to sell their "toys" now to support a family, some of the sellers can be desperate.

Getting a motorboat is asking for trouble unless you're an experienced master marine mechanic. I'd hate to be 9 miles off the coast with a dead motor.

Join a club, get reciprocal privileges with foreign marinas etc. A boat can be great and if you find a decent marina or cheap mooring it can be a 2nd home/vacation home. It gives you piece of mind IF the s h t f. I was good friends with a couple who "knew!" that "the S H T F" was gonna happen in 2k (hahhaha!) they loaded up their catamaran and moved to S America. Nice couple- although none too bright. The "end of the world as they knew it" never happened. I wonder whatever happened to those two?

Food with a boat: on a sailboat in the middle of the ocean far from any land or other boats it is NOT easy to catch fish- fish are attracted to all the chum those day sea-fishing boats put out and their engine noises. Fish like habitats: oil platforms, etc so you want to go to those for fish. Oh- and WATCH OUT for those GI-GAN-TIC ocean going vessels! ho-leee CRAP those things are huge! scared the ^&*O out of me one night... they can't stop nor will notice you so you MUST be out of their way at all times.

What IF SHTF?? will you be close to your life saving boat..? how will you get to it or will someone ELSE make use of it before YOU do??


Best place in tewokeqiqiki or whatever the anagram is: USA. This country has so many vast spaces, good for FARMING that are just sitting there, unused. Other nations do not have are arable land, our climate, anything. America is where other peoples CAME to TO farm- not other way round. There is soooo much lush forest land in USA a man could get lost for years and almost never be found if he's careful.

You have to think of food and water. On the sea, one can make do very meagerly with a solar still and dew. On a boat, every morning every surface is covered in moisture which is PURE water. Fish at sea are few and far between! like I said, look for habitat.

 Islands are ALL populated- by people who like their privacy and DO NOT ENJOY uninvited visitors- at ALL.

to phrase a scene of a famous film we all watched as children "HEY! How'd you like it if someone picked YOUR apples!!"
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: car54 on March 17, 2015, 08:55:55 AM
Back in the 70s my brother and I sailed all over the great lakes one summer. We picked up odd jobs in small towns along the coast in Michigan, Ohio, Wisconsin and Canada. We had a good time.

In the 80s we did some sailing around the Caribbean, Bahamas etc on a 36 foot sailboat. There is a whole community of people who live on boats. If you get into that lifestyle you will learn where to go, what to do and how to do it. Most people just migrate from one island to another, often in groups of friends they meet along the way.  Nearly all of those people have some form of income, whether a pension or some type of online business or they charter their boats or do seasonal work, though there is not much in the way of seasons except hurricane season in the Caribbean. 

With modern electronics, GPS, cell phones, satellite phones, better solar panels, wind generators etc it is much easier to live on board than even just ten years ago.  The thing is that when you are not actaully sailing, laying around you working in your boat. That's the lifestyle. That's what you do.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Smurf Hunter on July 24, 2017, 10:46:40 AM
My wife and I are taking sailing lessons next month.  No immediate ambitions of owning a sailboat, but figure this allows some recreational opportunities for weekend rentals or possibly working as a crew on a someone else's boat.  It's not the cheapest thing, but it's a skill and the sailing school is highly regarded.

This doesn't apply to me perfectly based on my age and family, but there are some interesting points from the bug-out perspective.

http://ncrenegade.com/editorial/get-yourself-a-thirty-footer-and-go/
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: outoforder2day on July 24, 2017, 12:50:25 PM
Research the cruising lifestyle. (http://www.cruisingworld.com/)
Having a homestead, I would worry about my animals and the care of my property when I was away. I do know many people who live a lifestyle similar to this (RV) in retirement and I never got it. I also know some folks who have winter homes in the south (Florida, mostly). They don't have the repair costs, and basically have condos in both geographies so there's little to worry about maintenance wise.

All that being said, I do really want to take two years off at some point and do a circumnavigation with my family. It would allow me to show them the world from the water up. I think it would be an invaluably unique learning experience for my kids. Just need to find someone to take care of the homestead while I'm away.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Carl on July 24, 2017, 01:29:14 PM
  There are few places that one can land that aren't commercialized or inhabited.You pretty much must carry your own supplies and re-supply can be very costly. There are few fish and less drinkable water in open ocean and though power and communications are much better now,than in the past ,you are still mostly on your own.

  You are not likely to drown in an RV and have more interesting places to go. Bobby White ,a pilot I know has some videos of boat life .But bikini girls do not just magically appear.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTSilpLdXWo
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Smurf Hunter on July 24, 2017, 02:49:37 PM
It will be a while before I have the expertise or even desire to travel across open ocean.

I'm a few miles from some of the largest sheltered marine water anyplace:

(http://img.eetoolset.com/img?source=url%5Bhttp://svr.eporia.com/images/company_164/986752.JPG%5D&sink)

I think it could be great fun to take a couple weeks and travel someplace under my own skill. Maintaining indefinitely is a daunting mission, but like camping/backpacking, it could be fun for fixed durations.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Redman on July 25, 2017, 03:50:22 AM
And to go along with the hole in the water saying and the happiest days saying, Break Out Another Thousand.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Smurf Hunter on July 25, 2017, 09:25:11 AM
And to go along with the hole in the water saying and the happiest days saying, Break Out Another Thousand.

In that context, paying around $300 to rent a newer and well equipped 39 footer for a whole weekend might not be unreasonable.
I'd rather do that a few times a year as a mini-vacation than pay that each month to moor and maintain a boat.

If the SHTF, I can always crew on some rich guy's yacht. - LOL
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Sailor on July 25, 2017, 02:44:56 PM
Congrats Smurf on getting some sailing lessons, great idea in your part of the country. 

I have not lived aboard, but race a 20 foot Flying Scot on the weekends and bob around in a 26 foot boat in the gulf of Mexico during vacations. 

If you buy a boat buy one that has an established association and that has made thousands of boats.  This way parts and advice are very easy to find. 

Another thing, the smaller the boat the more it will get sailed.  Something like a Catalina 22, that has probably 15,000 boats in its class, and a very active fleet/association.  Easy to trailer them also.  Great to learn on in protected water. 

Run some wire up your back stay and start practicing CW with one hand and the other hand on the tiller!  :D
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Black November on July 25, 2017, 02:55:39 PM
27 ft is pretty small to live in full time. I would recommend 30' to 40' sailboat. Something that has a decent sized shower. Larger than 40' and you would need a crew.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: mountainmoma on July 25, 2017, 04:35:37 PM
My youngest has been sailing a litte bit this summer with a young person that owns a sail boat here. She is learning some on sailing it, which is fun. I think there is some kind of wednesday night group sail. A few of them camped out over night on it on the 4th, which at this stage on it, is roughing it ! The young man who owns it used to live on it full time, quite a few people live full time on a boat docked at the harbor and pay a berth fee, he is staying mostly with his folks right now as he gutted the inside of the boat and is re-doing. Good hobby for a young person in college I think. Some are ripping apart their cars, some their motorcycles, and a few are gutting old sailboats I guess.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Smurf Hunter on July 25, 2017, 05:02:28 PM
27 ft is pretty small to live in full time. I would recommend 30' to 40' sailboat. Something that has a decent sized shower. Larger than 40' and you would need a crew.

From people I've talked to and what I've read, that's accurate.  It really is a bit of a pickle. 

Assuming cost is not a factor, the bigger boats are more stable and all around more appropriate for year round weather.
While there's more storage space for provisions and gear, you do need a crew at a point, which immediately offsets the additional space afforded.
Also, a longer hull can often most more to dock in marinas.

Aside from being uncomfortable (I'm 6'4"), the 27' boats are usually designed for fair weather weekend sailing, and have open air cockpits, or even tillers in some cases. 

In my thinking, get the biggest boat that you (and your sig other) can crew yourself.  Though when I was pondering some of this out loud, my wife asked a sensible question "what if one of is is injured or sick?  Do we die at sea because we have a crew of one?".  I am not experienced enough to answer that at this time...
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Carl on July 25, 2017, 05:20:18 PM
  For me a boat is at the top of the list of things that take far more money and maintenance than they are worth.

fancy Boat
fancy sports car
Fancy mistress
fancy wife
3 pull out ,pusher camper
personal airplane
Fancy Ham radio and tower
fancy house
horse
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Smurf Hunter on July 25, 2017, 05:28:45 PM
  For me a boat is at the top of the list of things that take far more money and maintenance than they are worth.

fancy Boat
fancy sports car
Fancy mistress
fancy wife
3 pull out ,pusher camper
personal airplane
Fancy Ham radio and tower
fancy house
horse

As I've mentioned, unless I have a massive unexpected windfall, I've no plans to own a boat.  But I do want to gain some sailing skills in case some other sucker with a 50 footer needs a crew member.
AKA: the only thing better than owning a boat, is a close friend who owns a boat ;)
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Carl on July 25, 2017, 05:35:01 PM
  Yes, a borrowed boat can be fun.I have lived on a houseboat ,on a river,but a sailboat is a whole other breed. Sailing can be a good skill to have...like flying as you never know when you will have to stand tall.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Black November on July 26, 2017, 08:26:07 AM
As I've mentioned, unless I have a massive unexpected windfall, I've no plans to own a boat.  But I do want to gain some sailing skills in case some other sucker with a 50 footer needs a crew member.
AKA: the only thing better than owning a boat, is a close friend who owns a boat ;)

Agreed. I have no plans to buy a boat. They cost more than their worth. However, if sailing is your thing, and that is all you dreamed about doing your whole life, being able to use it as a bug out vehicle is an additional benefit. 

[I did crew on a few boats when I was a younger]
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: surfivor on July 26, 2017, 09:14:45 AM
Agreed. I have no plans to buy a boat. They cost more than their worth. However, if sailing is your thing, and that is all you dreamed about doing your whole life, being able to use it as a bug out vehicle is an additional benefit. 

[I did crew on a few boats when I was a younger]

 I think I would have a fear of getting too far offshore, major storms, and pirates in various exotic places. You could also find yourself far from medical help where some helicopter would have to rescue you but in some parts of the world, no helicopter will be coming .. You are going to die someday anyway but still something to think about

 It might be nice though to arrive at some uninhabited island and stay there or other inaccessible places



https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/mar/01/mummified-body-of-german-man-found-in-yacht-adrift-off-philippines

Mummified body of German man found in yacht adrift off Philippines

..

Bajorat had reportedly been sailing the world on his yacht, Sayo, for the past 20 years.

Reports said he had not been sighted since 2009. But a friend told the media that he had heard from the mariner in 2015 via Facebook.

..

Bajorat’s body was found seated at a desk in the radio room, slumped over on his right arm “like he was sleeping”, said Navales.

..

Dr Mark Benecke, a forensic criminologist in the German city of Cologne, told the Bild newspaper: “The way he is sitting seems to indicate that death was unexpected, perhaps from a heart attack.”



=======

http://www.ybw.com/news-from-yachting-boating-world/german-sailor-found-dead-on-drifting-yacht-off-grenada-51607

Police in Grenada have confirmed that the decomposing body of a German sailor has been found on a yacht drifting seven miles south of the Caribbean island.

Officers said that a group of Grenadian divers spotted the 40-foot vessel, called Vamp, and reported it to the Grenada Coast Guard on 13 April 2017.

Coast Guard officials boarded the vessel, which had badly damaged sails, and found the decomposing body on board.



=======

http://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/2016/04/04/study-finds-more-deaths-in-us-from-sailing-than-football/

Providence, RI (April 4, 2016) – A new study from Rhode Island Hospital researchers based on data from the U.S. Coast Guard found that sailing in the U.S. has a higher fatality rate than football and downhill skiing.

Despite an image of carefree jaunts in sun-splashed waters, sailors experience fatalities at a higher rate than that of sports known for lightning speeds, falls and collisions. In fact, falls overboard, high winds, and operator inattention are known factors lifting American sailing death rates, with alcohol implicated in 15 percent of all sailing deaths.

..

By law, all boating deaths, disappearances, significant injuries and major vessel damage must be reported to authorities. The Coast Guard maintains a database of the reports, and the researchers analyzed the 4,180 reports detailing 271 fatalities and 841 injuries. They estimated the fatality rate at 1.19 deaths per million sailing person-days.

Comparatively, the fatality rates for alpine skiing and snowboarding are 1.06 per million skier/snowboarder person-days. During the 11-year study period, 271 deaths were related to sailing versus the 197 incidents of American football players who died during play or practice.

Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Carl on July 26, 2017, 09:44:36 AM
By law, all boating deaths, disappearances, significant injuries and major vessel damage must be reported to authorities.


So....you not only die at sea but can also go to jail?
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: surfivor on July 26, 2017, 09:55:05 AM
By law, all boating deaths, disappearances, significant injuries and major vessel damage must be reported to authorities.


So....you not only die at sea but can also go to jail?

 If you are in the middle of the ocean someplace, in the middle of the gulf of Mexico or off the coast of Cuba ..  how do you know which authorities or how do you contact them ?

 They find you dead and decide you broke the law, so they keep the boat or fine your relatives ?
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Carl on July 26, 2017, 10:01:30 AM
If you are in the middle of the ocean someplace, in the middle of the gulf of Mexico or off the coast of Cuba ..  how do you know which authorities or how do you contact them ?

 They find you dead and decide you broke the law, so they keep the boat or fine your relatives ?

It depends on which way you are headed....
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: surfivor on July 26, 2017, 10:09:37 AM
https://usatoday30.usatoday.com/money/industries/2003-03-11-fishing-safety_x.htm

Despite law, fishermen face deadliest job risks

==========

http://people.com/archive/a-students-death-at-sea-inspires-his-parents-crusade-for-fishing-boat-safety-laws-vol-25-no-15/

A Student's Death at Sea Inspires His Parents' Crusade for Fishing Boat Safety Laws

..


What horrifed the Barrys most of all was the fact that the deaths of their son, and of skipper Gerald Bouchard, 58, and hands Christopher Hofer, 27, Stuart Darling, 25, Chris McLain, 24, and Bill Posey, 24, were nothing out of the ordinary. In fact, fatal sinkings are routine occurrences in the perilous seas off Alaska and the Pacific Northwest. Since 1981 an average of 72 commercial boats have sunk there each year, and the sea has swallowed up a total of 108 fishermen. Nationwide the numbers are even higher, with 250 fishing boats sinking—and an average of 86 lives lost—each year. These grim statistics make commercial fishing the nation’s most dangerous business, with a death rate seven times higher than the national average for occupations and two times higher than mining, the next most hazardous job.


Those facts moved Robert Barry to act. On the day after the memorial service for Peter, he sat down and wrote an article highlighting the dangerous lack of safety regulations in the fishing industry. Published by several small newspapers in coastal towns, the article was later distributed by the Associated Press. Barry hoped that it would serve as a warning to the estimated 20,000 people—many of them college students—who flock to Alaska each summer to find adventure and big paychecks in the fishing industry. “My first aim is to bring the dangers of the problem to everybody’s mind,” Barry says, “especially the kids who go up there to fish.”


But Barry did not stop there. He and his wife have been lobbying Congress for legislation mandating minimum safety standards in the fishing industry. “There should be compulsory legislation for emergency beacons, survival suits and life rafts,” says Barry. “And the Coast Guard should have seaworthiness inspections for older vessels.”

Meanwhile the families of three of the other drowned crew members have filed suit against the estate of Bouchard, who owned the boat, claiming “wrongful death due to the negligence of the captain.” Lisa McLain, the widow of one crewman, points out that she was pregnant when her husband died. “For a while I had to rely on the state [for welfare],” she says. “It has not been fun.”


Several of the parents of Western Sea victims have joined the Barrys’ crusade. Among them is Mrs. Rosemary Hofer of Brielle, N.J., mother of Christopher Hofer. “I had no idea of the danger until this happened,” she says. “Something has got to prevent these boys who have a sense of adventure from going out there.” And soon something might do just that: In the past month, three bills dealing with the problem have been introduced in the House of Representatives. Hearings are scheduled next week, and Peggy Barry is expected to testify. “In one way doing something like this helps,” she says. “It makes you feel like you are doing something that is connected to Peter, something that can help other kids.” Then she pauses. “But the grief is so visceral. I know it will never go away.”

=============

http://www.wavetrain.net/techniques-a-tactics/492-salvage-law-when-do-get-to-keep-an-abandoned-boat

SALVAGE LAW: Do You Get to Keep an Abandoned Boat?
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Smurf Hunter on July 26, 2017, 10:18:11 AM
A lot of us veteran preppers tend to worry less about complete, and permanent collapse that leads to a MadMax RoadWarrior scenario.
The closest thing might be something like the LA Riots, multiplied several times.  Maybe a coup d'tat, etc.

Bugging out is extremely complex.  The pickle is, the closer you are to large urban centers, the higher your risk, but also the more difficult egress from the location becomes. If you already live in a rural town, your need to evac. is lower.

I'm sort of in between.  While I don't live in an urban center, I'm 20 miles out, and live along the major highway corridors. If holiday leisure traffic is any clue, the roads will be useless during a big emergency. The vast majority of situations are more appropriate for "bugging in" from my estimation.

The closest Marina is 8 miles west of my house.  Within 20 miles there are 4. It just seems a resource worth considering.
I also think it'd be fun to have a nice outdoor hobby.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Sailor on July 26, 2017, 10:32:18 AM
If you can sail a dingey well you can sail a much larger boat easily.  Key is just getting out there and doing it.  Just get on the water in any boat as much as possible.   Some guys at our marina in FL boat share.  Four families share one boat, and schedule their time on a shared google calendar.  It works well for them, as they are all friends and often go out together, and they are not boating full time.   It takes the right group of people though to pull that off. 
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: shadowalker_returns on August 19, 2017, 12:22:18 AM
The short answer is yes you can. The better answer is should you? On any non-Houseboat 30ft or less your not living aboard your camping aboard. A sailboat is the worst under 30ft boat to live aboard unless your single, an extreme minimalist, a bit of a masochist , skinny and short... No bullshit. I have been a live-aboard for real, as in it was my chosen life style up till my second wife and the 2 unplanned pregnancies... it is my go to life of choice and I am planning on returning to it again. My biggest boat was a 54 ft commercial conversion. I've lived aboard from Puget Sound to Florida bay and a whole lot of places in between... A 27ft sailboat of the proper type can be pleasant for one for a long time, 2 for much shorter time and 3 not for anytime more than a weekend. 30-33 ft is a better size. This assumes a full displacement hull. Some people said a sailboat is a must. They are wrong. Sailboats are mostly for romantics. The vast majority of truly successful long term live-aboarders live on powerboats. For two main reasons 1) Usable space and 2) Engines. In general power boats of equivalent length are more spacious. If properly designed and setup they can also be as space efficient as a good sailboat. Engines trump wind when you need to go NOW. When you take the long view and factor in the cost to maintain and replace the standing and running rigging along with necessary sail replacement, the over all cost of operation between a sailboat and an efficient power boat of similar displacement are remarkably close. Most sailboaters fail to mention this fact. Where sailboats can excel is for those few who love long distance blue-water cruising. Thats when sailboats can shine. Though I can still make a good case for an efficient powerboat of the proper design (and that would be my choice as well). as for size 27 ft is a great size to handle. Though any size can be singlehanded if designed, planned and equipped for it. I singlehanded my 54 ft all the time. Handling is really about pre-planning and experience, size is secondary. Your 27 footer would be a good choice for casual sailing/exploring camping aboard. If however you are a dedicated minimalist and are single then you could make a very good life for yourself aboard such a boat. At 27ft and depending on your hull/sail type, time and the weather will be your biggest enemies as your too small to push through weather and to slow to out run it. My first live aboard was a 22 ft houseboat like object, typically called a shanty boat. I loved it. Other more fru-fru ( ie. stuck up) boaters didn't. The real question is how do you want to use the vessel your living in. In-land waters or offshore? continuous movement or stop and go? Long term commitment or short term goal? and the big ones : how much Time, Money and Effort do you want or intend to spend on the vessel. if its mostly inland waters and bayous, you may want to consider sell trade up for a 30-35ft shallow draft high freeboard style Houseboat. Not to pretty but really practical for inland waterways stop and go or mostly stopped, live-aboarding. If you want to use your sailboat thats fine. here's how to do it. Ruthlessly evaluate its condition, then make the plans for needed changes to equip it to the level necessary for the use you intend, Make the changes and then Go For IT. The biggest disappointments in boating are the ones who wanted to go, who could go but never tried to go. Good luck to you.

Regards,
Shadowalker
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: John Doe on August 20, 2017, 11:28:01 AM
This is an idea I got from a guy who has a boat ..

 Suppose you lived in Maine and you had a 27 foot sailboat. Would it make sense and be economical as well as reasonably safe if you could set off on the sailboat in the late summer/early fall and sail down the coast for the winter ? Perhaps you anchor off of the coast in various places, thereby you don't have to pay for a hotel or a campsite at least some of the time. You could anchor in some harbor or inlet and go ashore in a smaller boat. Perhaps you could bring a small folding bicycle. I would bring a surfboard of course.

  If you get down to Florida, the Caribbean, South America, etc, maybe you find someplace of the coast that is not too inhabited, maybe part of some island. You could do some gorilla gardening, pick coconuts, various fruits, citrus or what not; learn what is edible etc ... You could catch fish to eat etc.. maybe even catch some game somehow ... I guess you could bring a bow and arrow .. I think some kinds of pink oyster mushrooms grow like crazy where it is hot as well.

 Obviously there are costs, various hazards and things to be aware of, but it seems like an interesting idea ...

BTDT in 2008/9
In the recession my job & everyone's who worked for me went to India.
Instead of fighting thousands of ppl for few jobs I sailed my boat down to the Keys from Norfolk.
I was living on the boat as I was separated at the time (we're back together :)
I would only do it in a 27' boat if it was outfitted with solar & wind generator, a proper nav system, dinghy or kayak to get to shore, full coverage BOAT towing ins (for "WHEN" you run aground & if it was just me or just me & someone I was really close to who's for it as much as you are.
I had a 27' boat at 1st. It was small (to live on) for ONE person..
My 30' boat made all the difference & she was the one I sailed down. It took 6 weeks from Norfolk to go 1200 miles, BTW.
Plan out time for stops, storms & plan on averaging 50-70 miles/day at about 7 knots/hr avg.
My #1 piece of advice: Buy the book Book by Skipper Bob about free anchorages. He rates them on many different categories like depth, privacy, services, grocery mkts, view etc link (https://www.waterwayguide.com/shipstore/advanced_search_result.php?ref=2&keywords=E-Book).
I would do it again in a heart beat but I doubt the wife would be into it :/
You'll employ many survival skills along the way too!
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: RitaRose1945 on August 20, 2017, 05:10:53 PM
 :popcorn:
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: shadowalker_returns on August 21, 2017, 03:10:41 PM
BTDT in 2008/9

I would only do it in a 27' boat if it was outfitted with solar & wind generator, a proper nav system, dinghy or kayak to get to shore, full coverage BOAT towing ins (for "WHEN" you run aground & if it was just me or just me & someone I was really close to who's for it as much as you are.
I had a 27' boat at 1st. It was small (to live on) for ONE person..
My 30' boat made all the difference & she was the one I sailed down. It took 6 weeks from Norfolk to go 1200 miles, BTW.
Plan out time for stops, storms & plan on averaging 50-70 miles/day at about 7 knots/hr avg.
My #1 piece of advice: Buy the book Book by Skipper Bob about free anchorages. He rates them on many different categories like depth, privacy, services, grocery mkts, view etc link (https://www.waterwayguide.com/shipstore/advanced_search_result.php?ref=2&keywords=E-Book).
I would do it again in a heart beat but I doubt the wife would be into it :/
You'll employ many survival skills along the way too!

Just about everyone I know who has BTDT also say 30' is the smallest practical size. Averaging 7 knots on less than a 30ft waterline single hull displacement boat is cooking! Good advice on Skipper Bob's book. I can't tell how many times it came in handing while I was living on the hook on the Carolinas to Florida coasts. I swear by and not at their guides. I primarily use the Upper Gulf and Texas Guide nowadays. I keep the West Florida coasts guide and Okeechobee Guides current as well.

Regards,
Shadowalker
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: archer on August 21, 2017, 03:14:37 PM
after spending a few days in 20' of a 60' ship, I now have a better understanding why 30' is better than smaller...
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Fyrediver on September 26, 2017, 09:56:56 PM
I have a former friend who is a Travel Nurse.  They live full time on their sailboat.  In the winter she works in the South, in the summer she works in the NE.  Of course, always in a port town.  Has a folding bicycle to pedal to work.  No rent etc and they move with the seasons. 
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Smurf Hunter on September 27, 2017, 11:20:10 AM
BTDT in 2008/9
In the recession my job & everyone's who worked for me went to India.
Instead of fighting thousands of ppl for few jobs I sailed my boat down to the Keys from Norfolk.
I was living on the boat as I was separated at the time (we're back together :)
I would only do it in a 27' boat if it was outfitted with solar & wind generator, a proper nav system, dinghy or kayak to get to shore, full coverage BOAT towing ins (for "WHEN" you run aground & if it was just me or just me & someone I was really close to who's for it as much as you are.
I had a 27' boat at 1st. It was small (to live on) for ONE person..
My 30' boat made all the difference & she was the one I sailed down. It took 6 weeks from Norfolk to go 1200 miles, BTW.
Plan out time for stops, storms & plan on averaging 50-70 miles/day at about 7 knots/hr avg.
My #1 piece of advice: Buy the book Book by Skipper Bob about free anchorages. He rates them on many different categories like depth, privacy, services, grocery mkts, view etc link (https://www.waterwayguide.com/shipstore/advanced_search_result.php?ref=2&keywords=E-Book).
I would do it again in a heart beat but I doubt the wife would be into it :/
You'll employ many survival skills along the way too!


Regarding Skipper Bob, while that sort of content sounds fantastic, it also appears very regional specific (ICW).  I'm way up in Puget Sound.  I've checked out some library books that cover my regional marinas and anchorages, but not fantastic depth of detail.  I'm early in my sailing "career", but am going out this weekend.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Smurf Hunter on October 02, 2017, 01:50:20 PM
Yesterday our family went out sailing in the afternoon.  It was both the biggest boat we'd sailed, and the first time my wife or I were the most experienced sailors on board.

Early in the day we had a few stressful points, but once we learned the running rigging of that particular boat, we got the sail trim dialed in and made the most of a light wind day.
This boat was a Catalina 27, and had a speedometer and depth meter.  First time I ever sailed with a speedometer, and it was GREAT.

To a non-sailor, it may sound strange, but it's difficult to estimate your VMG (velocity made good) without a lot of experience.  That speedo told the truth and gave us feedback as to how our sheets were trimmed.
Best we made was about 5.5 knots, but we were sailing.  We were out 5 hours and they time went by really fast.

While there's room for all in the cockpit, during tacks and jibes getting 4 people out of each other's way is not always smooth.  There was a reasonable cabin for the kids, but hanging down there wasn't fun.
While set on a given tack, my kids enjoyed sitting up towards the bow deck, but changing tacks would whack them with the jib sail, so that was only a temporarily seating location.

My kids are 13 and 11, not grown adults.  It would be awkward at best for more than a couple to live on such a boat for more than a long weekend I think.
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: Carl on October 02, 2017, 02:00:54 PM
  While it may be 'romantic', sailing can be rough and tough whenn in such small confines of a boat ,especially if winds and seas are larger.

I know a man,BOBBY WHITE ,who went naughtical and his adventure may be entertaining for some.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTSilpLdXWo&list=PLfyGJYbk3iSr_x19lqmg6H3w19NTpRDBY
Title: Re: live/retire on a sailboat part of the year ?
Post by: nathans on December 17, 2018, 07:51:44 PM
This is an intresting thread for several reasons and you need to think carefully about if you can cope with a sailboat!
you will need to be handy with tools for one and able to be able to think of solutions with nothing near you.
also your location will play a big part there is no point bugging out on a lake or closed river system.
you need to be able to pack well and in every little hole, and when packing for a boat there is no room for buckets of food, but there is plently of room for water proof packages vacum bags that sort of thing.
From personal experiance:
I now live on a 30ft sailboat with my dog and partner, we have a years worth of staple food aboard nothing fancy! lol i have made a solar water desaltation system that fills our tanks at a slow rate, i have solar walkablbe panels on my decks a wind turbine and solar oven so i know as a general cope for a month or two at sea is ok for us.
can we cope long term thats unlikely as you will need other items you will also need to get trade working for being on a boat you could have the upper hand of moving stuff from one place to another. but you will need to land now and then and then you have the weather to play with so there is lots of bonuses but also negitives
I am lucky that i already planned for this boat as a liveabroad and for it to get out of dodge
i am also on the south coast of england so easy to leave and get to multiple places

you will have a lot to think about if you plan for a boat and you will have to consider how you will survive at sea!