Author Topic: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:  (Read 7491 times)

Offline Carl

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #30 on: May 23, 2017, 09:55:29 AM »
  I think manufactures use NEW lead for consistency as it effects accuracy and expansion while re-loaders use cast bullets a manufacturer depends on consistency for how their bullets are poured,swagged,or ?? to insure bonding to jacket and expansion is also consistent.Though large volume operations can make for uniform metal recipes, a small caster tends to vary too much from batch to batch. I used materials from both types of operation though my favorite was BARNES bronze alloy for the SWAT guys as it was always consistent.

My two cents while operating PSK31 and communicating with a Ham radio operator in Memphis as I move screen to screen to add to this post.
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Offline The Professor

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #31 on: May 23, 2017, 02:33:14 PM »
I find this interesting, do you have a source that states the ammo manufacturers are having a hard time procuring lead? I was under the impression that the smelting plant made "new lead" and that most ammo manufacturers used "recycled lead" and therefore it was not a major impact as there is a good supply of recycled lead.

Other than an exerpt from a discussion with an Olin rep while partaking in an Intergalactic Kegger and enjoying a Body Shot from a disturbingly-dressed redheaded cowgirl (Leather Chaps, boots, halter, Cowboy Hat and G-string. . .disturbing in that she had no gunbelt. . .a blatant disregard for the atmosphere, all things considered).

I'm pretty sure that's what he said as he delved entirely too deeply into the whole engineering side of things.  Granted, I was a bit distracted at the time. . .the redhead had a friend.

I learned two things about myself that night. . .the first is that high-volume bullet-making is much more difficult than I thought, and the second that I can hold a rather copius amount of tequila in my belly button.

But that's another story, entirely.

The Professor
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Offline Smurf Hunter

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #32 on: May 23, 2017, 02:36:43 PM »
Other than an exerpt from a discussion with an Olin rep while partaking in an Intergalactic Kegger and enjoying a Body Shot from a disturbingly-dressed redheaded cowgirl (Leather Chaps, boots, halter, Cowboy Hat and G-string. . .disturbing in that she had no gunbelt. . .a blatant disregard for the atmosphere, all things considered).

I'm pretty sure that's what he said as he delved entirely too deeply into the whole engineering side of things.  Granted, I was a bit distracted at the time. . .the redhead had a friend.

I learned two things about myself that night. . .the first is that high-volume bullet-making is much more difficult than I thought, and the second that I can hold a rather copius amount of tequila in my belly button.

But that's another story, entirely.

The Professor

Only the professor is able to digress to that from a conversation about metal composition.

Offline The Professor

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #33 on: May 23, 2017, 03:14:30 PM »
Only the professor is able to digress to that from a conversation about metal composition.

Sorry, I forgot to say that was this last SHOT Show (2017).  Even the memory of that discussion is a tad bid distracting.

The Professor
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Offline Smurf Hunter

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #34 on: May 23, 2017, 03:20:42 PM »
Sorry, I forgot to say that was this last SHOT Show (2017).  Even the memory of that discussion is a tad bid distracting.

The Professor

Yeah, I see what you did there.   :beer:

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #35 on: May 23, 2017, 03:20:56 PM »
  I think manufactures use NEW lead for consistency as it effects accuracy and expansion while re-loaders use cast bullets a manufacturer depends on consistency for how their bullets are poured,swagged,or ?? to insure bonding to jacket and expansion is also consistent.

When i researched this when it first came up, most of the major US bullet manufacturers used lead from recycled auto batteries.  There were both economic and process reasons for doing this. That is, it was easier to use the recycled material than the new material from ore.   In fact, one of the bullet manufacturers had their plant just a few miles from the ore smelter that was closing but it didnt impact them at all because they exclusively used the recycled auto battery material provided by the same company.  I will see if I can find those those articles.  This said, the market has to be somewhat fungible and lead prices have been on an upswing lately.

Offline The Professor

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #36 on: May 23, 2017, 04:03:10 PM »
When i researched this when it first came up, most of the major US bullet manufacturers used lead from recycled auto batteries.  There were both economic and process reasons for doing this. That is, it was easier to use the recycled material than the new material from ore.   In fact, one of the bullet manufacturers had their plant just a few miles from the ore smelter that was closing but it didnt impact them at all because they exclusively used the recycled auto battery material provided by the same company.  I will see if I can find those those articles.  This said, the market has to be somewhat fungible and lead prices have been on an upswing lately.

Well, ultimately, even if they were rolling in appropriate material, it won't affect the window as will the military, political and economical factors will.  Warehouses are full, coffers aren't, buyer's aren't feeling the need to buy out of panic, right now and EVERYONE is trying to tread water.

This window won't last.  Colt has laid off a ton of workers, Olympic has closed it's doors, Remington closed it's Kentucky plant where they were making the Marlin guns.  Gander Mountain is filing bankruptcy and closing it's doors, allegedly because of the rapid decline of gun sales.

Massive Supply and No Demand equals GREAT OPPORTUNITY.

But, again, it won't last.  Things will flatten out, prices will plateau and start climbing back up here when the next major election cycle starts turning.

It's simply a window of opportunity if someone wishes to take advantage of it.

The Professor
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Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #37 on: May 23, 2017, 05:25:11 PM »
Massive Supply and No Demand equals GREAT OPPORTUNITY.

But, again, it won't last.  Things will flatten out, prices will plateau and start climbing back up here when the next major election cycle starts turning.

It's simply a window of opportunity if someone wishes to take advantage of it.

Yep, 100% agree.  It is hard to not see the opportunity when base ARs from major gun brands are selling for $410 (pre tax). 

Did look up the situation with lead for bullet manufacturers.  The smelter which closed was a primary one which turned ore into pure lead. Such a plant cant produce "small" runs of alloys cost effectively.  They have to concentrate on pure lead manufacture to make the economies of scale work. Bullet manufacturers primarily use cores of alloys (e.g. 90% lead 6% antimony, 4% tin). So it is cheaper to get the alloy from the recycling plants which can effectively do small batches exactly as needed.  Plus this allows bullet manufacturers to diversify suppliers thereby reducing risk to operations.  Since 99% of all lead is recycled (it is the easiest of all metals to recycle because of its density), the risk of not having US plant is minimal.  The 1% is easily imported in manufactured goods from Mexico and China each year.  Here is a statement from Sierra which summarizes this: https://sierrabulletsblog.com/2013/11/01/sierra-responds-how-will-the-closure-of-the-lead-smelting-plant-affect-sierra-bullets/

I was wrong about the sbove being a rebate war.  A buddy who owns a gun shop pointed out that most of those brands were from the same parent company.  He said he expects S&W, Ruger, and several others to respond this weekend.  He thinks we can see popular semi-auto handguns dropping from $500-$600 to $400.  He is trying to clear all second tier manufacturer handguns from inventory at cost to take advantage of the dealer incentives from the big guys.

Between that and the pencil barrel, it's l-i-g-h-t.

That is spot on.  I chose the QRC because of its lightness.  it is like 5.2 lbs so with a small konus red dot and 20 round mags it should be just over six pounds.  This is just about perfect for soneone of shorter status like my wife, especially with the smaller mag and folding stock.  Personally, I prefer my 20 inch hbar fixed stock despite its 8lb girth.

Offline ncjeeper

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #38 on: May 23, 2017, 08:13:24 PM »
  Gander Mountain is filing bankruptcy and closing it's doors, allegedly because of the rapid decline of gun sales.
Nobody bought guns from Gander because they were way over priced.
The early bird gets the worm.....But the second mouse gets the cheese.

Offline FreeLancer

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #39 on: May 24, 2017, 05:44:52 PM »
I ordered some Singapore Military 5.56 from Bulk Ammo last night, apparently manufactured by Magtech in Brazil. The blurb said they are ultra particular about their ammo specs, requiring sealed primer pocket and case mouth, sealed 200rd poly bags with desiccant, and a steel ammo can sealing 1000rds. The cans are stored for 7 years in an air conditioned building and then replaced with a new production run. That seems like some serious overkill to me, but this is a country that makes you scrap a car when it's 10 years old, so maybe it's just the way they roll over there.

Edited to add the best part:  30 cents per round.
« Last Edit: May 24, 2017, 07:35:07 PM by FreeLancer »
23:57:30

Offline chrisdfw

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #40 on: May 24, 2017, 05:56:25 PM »
Ugh.  I just couldn't take it anymore. I dont have a flattop AR so I just ordered a Bushmaster QRC.  galleryofguns.com has them on inventory reduction here: http://galleryofguns.com/Gallery/HotDeals.aspx?evt=Inventory%20Reduction%20Sale&brand=BushmasterIncluding taxes, dealer fees, etc. it comes in at $454.95 after $75 rebate.  And that includes Davidson's lifetime warranty: http://www.galleryofguns.com/about/terms.aspx.  It will be a good loaner rifle.

https://www.bushmaster.com/firearms/xm-15-qrc/16-optics-ready


I just ordered one too. Because, America!

these deals get down to where its almost the same price as building it myself... without all the work. I hardly will build a basic aR15, not worth the effort, saving the effort for special builds where I want it just a certain way at these prices.

Might order another on payday... and after that too

Offline Alan Georges

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Offline chad

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #42 on: May 24, 2017, 07:26:49 PM »
Fire sale....on guns and ammo..boys and girls... smoke'em if you got'em...

Offline iam4liberty

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Offline chad

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #44 on: May 24, 2017, 08:01:22 PM »
Apparently from the box image 00 buck is just perfect for both rabbits and house cats!




Holy s$ht, the progressives have taken over bullet manufacturing.. Ferrell cats maybe, cotton tail not so much.

Offline Alan Georges

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #45 on: May 24, 2017, 08:08:27 PM »
Apparently from the box image 00 buck is just perfect for both rabbits and house cats!
Look again at the proportions of the animals in the illustrations.  Wererabbits!  Werecats!   :tinfoily:  They could already be your neighbors!

I swear, there are times it seems like "Baofeng" is Cantonese for "hot mess."

Offline Carl

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Stop complaining about life and start Celebrating it .

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Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #47 on: May 25, 2017, 11:05:02 AM »
This NRA article is pretty on point.  Might be worth sending to anyone on the fence to encourage them.

https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2017/5/9/6-guns-to-look-for-in-a-buyers-market/?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=insider&utm_campaign=0517
6 Guns To Look For In a Buyer's Market

New shooting enthusiasts and first-time gun owners often have their interest in firearms sparked by one particular facet of the shooting sports. But once the gun bug bites, it's only natural to feel a desire to explore more shooting endeavors. Thanks to a current favorable climate when it comes to our 2nd Amendment rights, we have at long last returned to a buyer's marketplace. Dealers’ shelves are well-stocked with a variety of options at reasonable prices. This means now is a great time to try something new.

Each of the following guns will provide new shooters with important operational experience. Someone who understands how to run at least one gun in each of these categories will have a basic understanding of how to use just about every make and model that can be purchased at local outdoor retailers.

Offline NWPilgrim

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #48 on: May 25, 2017, 05:11:01 PM »
It is easy to get lulled into thinking these prices will be around for a long time and no hurry to replenish or build up supplies.  But the Professor is right that these are just the beginning of good deals but they won't last.  Probably for sure 3 months at least, maybe 6 months, but beyond that it could get iffy as surpluses get bought up and manufacturer cutbacks on production/staffing start rebalancing the supply.
There have always been times like this, and there will be again. Will we rise to the challenges or get run over?


Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #50 on: June 01, 2017, 09:41:18 PM »
Here come some handgun discounts and rebates.  For example S&W Shields down to $215 with rebate and Walther PPS down to $310 with rebate.






Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #51 on: July 23, 2017, 05:26:31 PM »
FYI, my Bushmaster rebate came in last week.  That was pretty fast.

Also just a reminder that several of the rebates are ending July 31.  So if you are considering a $400 AR or other heavy discounted items, you might want to make a decision soon.

https://www.rkguns.com/dpms-panther-oracle-223-5-56-ar-15-rifle.html

LAST CHANCE TO GET A QUALITY AR-15 UNDER $400!
ORDERS MUST BE PLACED BY 7/31 TO QUALIFY!

« Last Edit: July 23, 2017, 05:33:49 PM by iam4liberty »

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #52 on: October 06, 2017, 10:33:09 PM »
FYI.  Delton has deal at Rural King for the Delton Echo 316H Lite optics ready - $389.00.  This is the version without the forward assist and dust cover.

https://www.rkguns.com/del-ton-echo-316h-5-56mm-nato-semi-automatic-ar-15-rifle-orfth16-lt.html


Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #53 on: October 09, 2017, 08:15:46 AM »
Is $389 too much for your buget?  How about $352?!  That is how much today's gallery of guns deal is to my local gun store for a polymer ATI Omni Hybrid Maxx P3 M4 Flat Top Carbine. Very lite at about 5 1/2 lbs.  Clearly this wont last long at this price.

http://www.galleryofguns.com/genie/default.aspx?item=atigomx556p3&utm_source=icontact&utm_medium=email&utm_content=500&utm_campaign=product_spotlight



UPC:    819644020189
Description:    ATA OMNI MAXX HYB P3 5.56 16B
Brand:    American Tactical Imports
Model:    Omni Hybrid Maxx P3 M4 Flat Top Carbine
Type:    Rifle: Semi-Auto
Caliber:    5.56 NATO|223
Finish:    Black
Action:    Semi-Automatic
Stock:    6 Position Stock with Pistol Grip
Sight:    No Sights
Barrel Length:    16 M4 Nitride Coated Barrel, 1-7 Twist
 Overall Length:    31.25 to 34.875
Weight:    5.65 lbs
Capacity:    30+1
# of Mags:    1
Safety:    Manual Safety
Receiver:    Steel Reinforced Polymer Upper And Lower
Features:    Beveled Mag Well,;
Surefire Institute NANO Composite Parts Kit



Offline Smurf Hunter

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #54 on: October 09, 2017, 08:31:49 AM »
There are two higher level motivations for buying another AR and/or accessories right now:

1) fear of future restrictions could dry up supply and increase costs
2) stuff is so cheap, you should "buy low"

Not having a crystal ball, I can only offer speculation for #1.

For #2, I still think VALUE matters.  I've bee on limited budgets fairly often, but one redeeming thing about AR-15s is the modularity. 
If you only have $200-300 today, but a lower.  Either completed or stripped with a kit. 

You can get a stripped lower for $50-100 all day long right now.
$50 or so gets you a basic lower parts kit.
Stocks/buffers/tubes can be found for $75, but $100-150 gets you something nice.

BCM makes a fantastic LPK with a really decent trigger for about $100-120
https://www.rainierarms.com/manufacturers/bravo-company-mfg/bcm-enhanced-lower-parts-kit-ar15/?nosto=nosto-page-category2
Seems expensive compared to the $60 LPK, but consider what an aftermarket trigger costs, and this is a bargain.

While these < $400 complete rifles are an impressive value, you might consider spreading your budget over time and building a rifle with better components.

Offline The Professor

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #55 on: October 09, 2017, 03:16:46 PM »
I'm thinking of going a different route.

As a general rule, the Spousal Unit and I have five AR's apiece.  There are reasons for this, which I'll try to explain.

Rifle #1:  A  highly modified and custom-built Frankenrifle designed with the end of the world in mind.  Ultimately, it will shoot from 50-grain to 100-grain bullets, needs no external lubrication, is sub-MOA accurate, and has a barrel designed to last hundreds of thousands, not merely tens of thousands, of rounds.  I've posted details elsewhere here on TSPF, in the past.  A search for my moniker and "Frankenrifle" should pull it up.

The spouse has one similar, but externally finished a bit differently with different furniture, but the same internals, upper/lower and barrel.  I did have her barrel turned down to save weight.

Rifles #3&4: Identical matches to each other.  They're standard Noveske Generation 3 Switchblock Rifles in 5.56x45.  We both have two of them because we always take a spare to 3-gun matches or when we go to a shooting class.  It's just something we learned.

Rifles #5&6: Identical matches to each other.  These are AAC MPW's in .300 Blackout.  Pairing is for the same reason as for numbers 3 and 4, above.  We are considering making the .300 Blackout caliber our primary defensive longarm, so we're shooting these primarily in Run & Gun and in classes.    Eventually, they will be suppressed and SBR'd to reduce size, for carrying, and signature, for use, if we decide to go this final route.

Beyond that, we would be purchasing any other AR's in a simple, basic format as inexpensively as possible.  These would be put back, after being shrinkwrapped in their original boxes, specifically for investment purposes.

I do foresee another panic situation happening in the next few years.  Whoever's going to run against Trump during the  next election is going to be solidly anti-gun.  They won't have to lean towards the mainstream.  Their mindset is going to be proposing the "Anyone But Trump" agenda, just as the Right ran an "Anyone But Hillary" campaign.

It doesn't matter who wins, as long as people feel their future purchases will be threatened.  We've seen it in the past.

The real difference, this time, is that there's been a SIGNIFICANT gap between Trump being elected and a subsequent relaxing in the concern of any firearms ban.  There is a surplus of AR's on the market and those will dry up quickly.

Since so many gun manufacturers have gone out of business, we no longer have the manufacturing base we had following Obama's re-election.  Most of them simply couldn't survive the slump in sales.  So, there's going to be a gap between when inventory sells out and new product is made at a rate that will meet, or exceed, demand.

That's where my investment rifles come in.  I saw off-name AR's selling During the latter part of 2012 (obama's re-election) for upwards of $2k.

Honestly?  Even if I double my investment, I'll be happy.

The Professor
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Offline Smurf Hunter

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #56 on: October 09, 2017, 03:41:57 PM »
While I understand the investment aspect, I think you'd do just as well to buy stock in a gun company.
Unfortunately aside from Ruger and S&W, there aren't many publicly traded small arms manufacturers.

Though consider Ruger (RGR).  If you'd bought stock immediately after the Dec. 2012 Newton, Conn. sandy hook school shooting @ ~$45/share and held for just over a year, you could sell for over $80/share.
Sure, there are some logistics and tax considerations, such as storing investment guns, or paying capital gains taxes on sold stock.



I'd rather own $10,000 worth of stock equity that I can click a mouse in a web browser and sell than have as much in physical hardware. 

I bought a bunch of RGR just before the presidential election, assuming a Clinton victory.  That was a goof on my part, but recent events have recovered 90% of the losses since.

Offline The Professor

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #57 on: October 09, 2017, 06:44:32 PM »
While I understand the investment aspect, I think you'd do just as well to buy stock in a gun company.
Unfortunately aside from Ruger and S&W, there aren't many publicly traded small arms manufacturers.

Though consider Ruger (RGR).  If you'd bought stock immediately after the Dec. 2012 Newton, Conn. sandy hook school shooting @ ~$45/share and held for just over a year, you could sell for over $80/share.
Sure, there are some logistics and tax considerations, such as storing investment guns, or paying capital gains taxes on sold stock.



I'd rather own $10,000 worth of stock equity that I can click a mouse in a web browser and sell than have as much in physical hardware. 

I bought a bunch of RGR just before the presidential election, assuming a Clinton victory.  That was a goof on my part, but recent events have recovered 90% of the losses since.

We have regular investments, as well.  But this physical investment is something I consider entirely different, here's why:

1.   In 1994, just a few months before the 1994 Omnibus Crime Act (AKA, the 94 Assault Weapon Ban) my wife and I (yes, the same wife) invested approximately $6,000 dollars by buying 10, Colt AR15's at (iirc) $575 apiece.  Less than six months later, we walked out of the first gunshow after he signed the bill with $30,000 in cash, in our hands.  Our only cost was $40 for a table and we were gone within the first three hours of the show opening up.

2.  In 2007, those AR15's retailed for a little more than 800 dollars.  The AWB had sunset and prices were balancing out.  Less than 1 year later, Obama gets elected and the prices of AR's went up to as high as $3795 at the Denver Tanner Gun Show for a Standard 6920.  For two years afterwards, you could not find a lower or a parts kit that ran within spitting distance of their 2007 prices.

3.  In 2012, when Obama got re-elected, I sat and watched a  grown man cry, thinking his gun business would be closing.  No one seriously believed that he'd get re-elected and there was a heavy push for gun Control, especially a month later when the Sandy Hook shooting happened.  This time, however, many manufacturers were ready and had cash to burn.  Price went up for a couple of months until the smaller shops started turning out lowers in sufficient quantities.  Likewise, lower parts kits disappeared, but showed back up.  The price for an AR rifle, complete, only doubled for a few months.  In some cases, early on, they tripled, depending on the ass***ishness of the dealer.

4.  A firearm is a hard asset.  I can practically guarantee you that, if you have any sense, you will not sell it for less than you have in it.  But it does take some knowledge and consideration.  For example.  Choose a common firearm, one that people see or like such as the AR-series rifle, the basic AK and a Glock 19 or 17 (Until recently, I would have added in a G22 and G23).  All are immediately recognizable and are chambered in calibers that are easy to find.  Additionally, magazines are plentiful and not too expensive (try finding an original Bren Ten magazine at a local gun show). If you buy any of these firearms for investment, YOU WILL NOT LOSE MONEY if you buy them on sale.  For example: Right now there are G19 Generation 3's, nib for approximately $425 online with free s/h.  Find a cheap and friendly FFL and reduce the cost of your transfer fee.  But let's say it's $450.  Right now, you should be able to sell that pistol (and not to a dealer) for $450, legally. 

5.  Since this is a Survival Board concerned with Survival topics, when Kim Broke Dong launches his EMP over the U. S. of A. and the power goes out or when the Chinese decide to invade to capture War Brides, you have an item that will be in demand AND you can trade/barter/sale, unlike stock in a gun company.  There's no one to call, no one to give a sell order to, no internet is needed for your day-trading activities, no need to transfer money from your E*Trade account, no forms to fill out, nothing.  It is an immediately accessible item with value.

6.  If any of the aforementioned survival scenarioes play out, they have the added benefit of being able to be USED by you, your family and your friends to defend yourself.  Yes, since I was an Army SEAL, I know four ways to kill a person with a rolled-up stock certificate (six, if it's a Preferred Stock with the little gold label), but I'd rather use something that requires less effort.

I could go on, but it's a simple as this:  I diversify.  The only real problem with AR's and AK's as investments is the sheer size of them and storage.  Try storing even a dozen G19's in your safe where they're protected against fire, etc.  What we did was to buy the least expensive fire-resistant safes and store those items in it.  Our Big-A**ed Fort Knox is for my good stuff.

Someone will inevitably ask the question about Gold and Silver.  After all, one gold round is worth approximately $1300, right now, and one ounce of silver about $17.  The problem is, in my opinion, that the average person is unaccustomed to accepting either medium as a form of payment.  Older people may, especially those who remember precious metal-backed money.  But Amber and Hunter Crossover?  Nope.  Plus, $1300 is a hard nut to crack (yes, buy 1/10 oz pieces).

We do invest in Gold and Silver. . .much more in silver than gold.  twice in my lifetime we've seen silver almost quadruple in price.  The last time, I had four, 100-oz bars that I let go at $44/oz.  I was a happy person.  But, I had to go to a coin shop to do it.  That's not something I can necessarily guarantee in a time of crisis.  But, I do have them as investment media. . .mainly to pass down to the kids.

These are the major reasons why I suggested investing in firearms and getting them now, while prices are ridiculously low.  I don't see this opportunity coming again anytime in the foreseeable future. 

Just as with all of my suggestions, they are worth exactly what you paid for them.

The Professor
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Offline Smurf Hunter

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #58 on: October 10, 2017, 07:41:40 AM »
Point taken.  One of the first new guns I puchased was a ruger gp100 revolver in .357.  I paid just over $400 a decade ago.  Today the identical model is $650.  With a little leg work I expect I could recoup my purchase price on the used market.  That's a gun I shoot on occassion, so it's a decent asset.  I'd have to be desperate to sell it, but nice to know I could profit a bit.

That brings up my next question - I assume you never shoot the investment guns?  With a few special exceptions, I don't own guns I don't shoot.  In fact I don't own many firearms in the context of other TSPers but I have multiple magazines, ammo, reloading components and consumable parts like gas rings, firing pins, etc

I have a dozen unopened pmags I paid $9.99 for.  I suppose if I could honestly fetch $50 or more I'd sell them, but primarily I just want them for the future.

Offline The Professor

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Re: Why NOW is the time to buy AR's and 5.56x45 ammo:
« Reply #59 on: October 10, 2017, 09:36:30 PM »
Point taken.  One of the first new guns I puchased was a ruger gp100 revolver in .357.  I paid just over $400 a decade ago.  Today the identical model is $650.  With a little leg work I expect I could recoup my purchase price on the used market.  That's a gun I shoot on occassion, so it's a decent asset.  I'd have to be desperate to sell it, but nice to know I could profit a bit.

That brings up my next question - I assume you never shoot the investment guns?  With a few special exceptions, I don't own guns I don't shoot.  In fact I don't own many firearms in the context of other TSPers but I have multiple magazines, ammo, reloading components and consumable parts like gas rings, firing pins, etc

I have a dozen unopened pmags I paid $9.99 for.  I suppose if I could honestly fetch $50 or more I'd sell them, but primarily I just want them for the future.

Generally, no.  I will if I pick up one that's used, just to make sure it runs.  Otherwise, I tend to buy new firearms from a reputable manufacturer, especially on sale.  As I said earlier in the thread, I then usually wrap the original box in shrinkwrap and store the guns that way.

Magazines are another area and remember 1994. . .30rd AR mags WERE going for as much as $40-$50 for a while, since manufacture of new "high-capacity" ones were illegal.

The Professor
On "The List" since 1994.  Isn't it about time YOU got on The List?

I once filled the best and brightest of our young men and women with important knowledge. . .now, I just get paid for my opinions.  Ain't Life Grand?