Author Topic: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?  (Read 248099 times)

Offline Reconnoiter

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Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« on: May 25, 2012, 05:43:35 PM »
The "Get Home Bag" makes total sense to me. You know how long it will take you to get home from work, school, the mall, your friends houses, and you pack for that. Done.

But "Bugging Out"? That means you are leaving your home (opposite of Bugging In). And, if so much "S" has "HTF" that we are forced to leave our homes, we might be gone a lot longer than 72 hours.

We often use a backpack, as our BOB, because we know that our car, truck, SUV, ATV, motorcycle, or scooter, may not run (EMP), or stop running (no fuel, mechanical breakdown, or collision).

A Bug Out Bicycle overcomes the EMP and fuel obstacles, and would be great if you're leaving from your house, but how many people can carry a bike, even a folding bike (plus spare parts, tires, tubes, chains, cables, and tools) in their car, everywhere they go?

If we REALLY want to prepare for the "worst case scenario" (plan Z), what we all need to prepare for, is walking. And if you live in a major city, it's going to take more than 72 hours to walk somewhere safe.

That brings up the question: "Can I carry, everything I'd need, on my back, if I were going to be gone for weeks, months, or longer?"

As a former member of a Search & Rescue Team, I've seen adult men who couldn't walk 10 miles with the gear they needed for just a few nights. And they had no firearms or ammo to carry.

With that in mind, I'd like to get feedback on the concept of a "BOBOW' (bob on wheels).

There are a variety of ways to go. I've left out rolling luggage, because an 8" wheel is about the smallest you want to deal with off road. Keep in mind, whatever you choose, you need to be able to carry it in your car. Here are a few options...

If you want to just add wheels to your current (or maybe a bit larger) BOB, this is a good option….



I like the Mega Mover Folding Hand Truck because it's very compact, has 8" wheels, and a 550lb capacity.

Watch video --  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_SzPI19GbvY
Where to buy --  http://www.amazon.com/Wesco-220650-WESCO-Folding-Trucks/dp/B0001YXXMW



Foldable Jogging Strollers work very well…



You can pick these up cheap at garage sales, but they're a little bulky when folded, and other than hauling kids, serve no other purpose.



Mono Walker (if you've got the buck$)



It's a backpack. It's a single wheel hiking trailer. It's two wheel bicycle trailer. It's over $1,000

Watch video -- http://www.monowalker.com/ENG-video.html
Where to buy -- http://monowalker.com/Shop/index.php



I really like the folding cart option….



The "Fold-it" utility cart is great because it's compact, light weight, holds 330lbs, won't rust, can be pulled with a bicycle. Plus, its a very handy thing to have when you get where you're going.

Watch video -- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=moFKGqp-HWs
Where to buy -- http://www.amazon.com/Tipke-2100-Marine-Fold-It-Utility/dp/B00006LPPJ



Game Carts…



Less than $100. Carries 500lbs. Folds in half, but you've got to take the wheels off to get it in the average trunk.

Watch video -- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ycf4eMfX5t4&feature=related
Where to buy -- http://www.amazon.com/Hunters-Deluxe-Hunting-Hauler-Utility/dp/B00699DULM/ref=pd_sim_sbs_sg_3



NOW!!!, if you're a nut ball (like me), and were inspired when you saw this guy….



… you can build something custom like I did…


?
I know it's bulky. I know it has to be assembled. But here's my reasoning:

#1  It holds WAY more than I could ever carry in a backpack.
#2  I can secure it in the back of my SUV (no trunk) with a cable to prevent a smash-n-grab theft.
#3  The lid locks making it a legal place (in CA) to carry firearms.
#4  It's rain proof.
#5  If I have to cross a river, or lake, It floats.
#6  It can be used to move up to 20 gallons of water.
#7  It has 26" solid rubber tires (no flats).
#8  Off the trailer, it works as a table, workbench, or chair.
#9  Items can be strapped to the top.
#10  I was bored last weekend and had nothing better to do ;-)
 
?


As for the parts:

The Box -- Contico Pro Tuff Bin (37x21x20) from Lowe's
http://www.lowes.com/ProductDisplay?partNumber=91573-230-L3725&langId=-1&storeId=10151&productId=3047281&catalogId=10051&cmRelshp=rel&rel=nofollow&cId=PDIO1

The Wheels -- Marathon Flat-Free Cart Tires (26x2.125) from NorthernTool.com
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200486374_200486374?cm_mmc=Google-pla-_-Tires%20%2B%20Wheels-_-Spoked%20Wheels-_-20717&ci_sku=20717&ci_gpa=pla&ci_kw=%7Bkeyword%7D

The Trailer Frame -- I built this my self using ¾" (1.05" OD) schedule 40 aluminum pipe and Hollaender Speed-rail fittings. The axle is ¾" All-thread with Nylon Nuts I also got from Lowe's.

Pipe - http://www.myaluminumsupply.com/cart/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=6
Fittings - http://www.hollaender.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=home.viewpage&page_id=EC24FDAE-CC9C-BA86-D8D542E83A8C403F



This is my Bug Out Vehicle, fully loaded…

?


... and everything in it, can be carried with my BOBOW!!!



Of course, if you're not that into preparing, you could always just "pick up" one of these…


… and be this guy...




[Edited to fix image links]
« Last Edit: May 31, 2012, 08:47:55 PM by Mr. Bill »

Offline RPZ

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #1 on: May 25, 2012, 06:14:01 PM »
Although I would agree that the typical 48 or 72 hour plan is based on much assumption, it is a general plan based on common occurences.

It should be reiterated frequently that anyone with the survival mindset ought to have better than average prospects if he, she, they have and make use of what is available to them after their "supplies" have been exhausted. In other words, every piece of gear you have carefully selected and know how to use, along with anything you can find and make use of after that.

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #2 on: May 25, 2012, 06:31:49 PM »
I've thought often if bugging out was a the right thing to do, and in some conditions it is.
I just don't want to bug out and not be able to return to my home for whatever reason.
Because when that happens, my status changes to refugee.
Refugees almost always fare very badly, suffer extreme hardship and deprivation, and you may not survive the experience.

Offline TexDaddy

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #3 on: May 25, 2012, 06:37:51 PM »
In most of the most probable bug out scenarios, the family car will be used, such as:

  • Train derailment or truck wreck involving toxic chemicals
  • wildfire
  • weather incident, if forewarned

On nearly any bug out, I will be starting out in a motor vehicle. That is what the gasoline stores are for. Very few cars won't start after the initial EMP blast is over.

Yes, the vehicle has provisions in case it must be abandoned, but those scenarios seem to me to be fairly far down the list in likely hood.

Walking would be a very last resort. Most times, you are much more vulnerable on foot than in a vehicle with the doors locked.

Alternate, less known routes must be planned in case the roads get jammed and I will not be waiting until the last minute to leave.

Offline TexasGirl

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #4 on: May 25, 2012, 06:58:11 PM »
My first thought, living in the country with sand and rough terrain, is anything with small wheels is a lost cause.  I like the idea someone had (on another thread) to find an old golf bag cart (cheap garage sale item) and retrofit it to carry a backpack style BOB, which could be quickly removed an thrown on the back when needed. 

The TexasGirl BOB is really a GHB, designed to get me back to the farm from somewhere else, within 6 days.  After 6, I would need to resupply food.  It is not a camping pack per se, but a survival aid.  Barring any physical injury, I should be able to pack it quite a ways, and it has the necessary goods for me to travel in unusual and/or varying degrees of hostile conditions, whether traveling by vehicle or by foot.

On the other hand, it could be used to "get out of Dodge" on a moments notice if a catastrophic event occured.  It lives in my vehicle, ready to go.

~TG

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2012, 07:48:29 PM »
The Texans pretty much got this one covered. 

I'd only add that my car kit is my GHB and it's modular.  One unit is gloves, longjohns, socks, wool hat.  One unit is my wilderness survival kit for day hikes, fire starting, a day's worth of snack calories and comfort foods, food heating and water purification.  One unit is rescue-oriented kit including first aid, rope, leather gloves, lock picks, small pry bar, folding shovel, hatchet, some basic mechanic's tools.  One unit is food and water.  One unit is seasonal weather gear (winter jacket or rain jacket, sweater or convertible pants, etc.).

I have a couple changes of clothes at work along with an urban survival kit (rappeling rope, harness, belay device, smoke hood, gas mask, disposable ponchos, flashlight, headlamp, three MREs, etc).  I have some stuff cached at a friend's house, which is my BOL if there's a wildland fire.

Basically, anything except a severe winter storm or wildland fire and I'll be looking to go home.  I'll want to travel light, so there's things in my car kit I'll readily ditch.   
 

Offline Alan Georges

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #6 on: May 25, 2012, 08:15:32 PM »
Most bug out scenarios give a few hours to days of warning, so a list is a better option there.  For example, we're up to eight hurricane evacuations, and there's plenty of time to run the list and get out of dodge.  The flip side is the true widespread SHTF scenario, in which case it's best to stay home.  Home may be where the heart is, but it's also where all my bullets, beans, and band-aids are stored.  (Except for a few strategically placed back-up caches, but that's another topic.)

OK, so what does that leave?  Scenarios where you have to run like hell right now.  The example TexDaddy gave of a toxic train wreck is a good one, one I've actually experienced in fact.  It's nice to have a change of clothes – my own clothes, not fresh from Wal-Mart and stiff with sizing – for an overnight motel stay in an event like that.  Another scenario where a BOB is good is for running to your bug-out location if the trip could take more than overnight.  But again, a BOB's only needed if you don't have an hour to run through a bug-out list.

I'm not discounting the worth of BOBs.  It's just that the go and go now emergencies are comparatively rare, and most of them consist of scooting two towns over to stay with friends for a day or so.  My BOB's pretty minimal.  All of this "The Road" stuff about wheeled carts and such is so far down in probabilities that I'll get to it as soon as I finish becoming fluent in Mandarin and brush up on my flying saucer operating techniques – i.e., never.

All of which reminds me: I really need to update my BOB.  Good project for this long weekend.

Offline Medicineball

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #7 on: May 25, 2012, 09:51:01 PM »
What a great thread...  It's worth noting that the people who take survival the most seriously focus on never having to bug out. And it's worth noting that the people who take bug out bags seriously (like my favorite, the guy who runs bugoutbagquest.com - now there's a guy who thinks about BOBs), see BOB's almost entirely as get home bags. The idea that you can take what you need with you for anything more than a couple of days is just the delusion of someone about to become a refugee. Don't mean to piss anyone off, JMHO. :)

Offline BillyS

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2012, 11:08:22 PM »
I keep starting to reply and get stuck. I'm not trying to sound superior or experienced or anything, but this is something I know: when shit happens in a hurry, you grab what you can and run. All the better if all the things you are most likely to need over the next few days are easy to grab.

Nobody can prepare for a plane crashing into the office. I'm not worried about EMP. I'm not worried about rogue baby-eating cannibals. I'm not worried about Soviets shooting up the high school. I'm not worried about zombies.

I'm not really worried... but I'm concerned about rising water. I'm concerned bout the giant ash and sweet-gum trees in my yard falling onto my house and doing more damage than the pear tree already did a few years ago (like the oak did when it smashed half my neighbor's house and crushed her car in the garage). I'm concerned about having to go through another full-scale evacuation like happened during Rita in 2005.

I think a total meltdown would take a long time to occur. We're not going to wake up tomorrow to people eating people because there is no food. It might happen; it's happened before, but it wouldn't happen before your BOB was used up and pretty much worn out.

The BOB is supposed to keep you clean, dry, fed, and comfortable for a period of time while the disaster passes. You cannot pack a lifetime of comfort into a backpack. Sorry, it just ain't happening.

Offline FreeLancer

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #9 on: May 26, 2012, 12:12:42 AM »
This is an interesting thread, and, yes, I do think we're kidding ourselves when it comes to BOBs, but in my situation (which is more Get Home than Bug Out) a cart will seriously hinder my mobility. 

I keep a bunch of gear in the back of my car and plan to customize my pack for the 20 mile walk home if I'm at work when the SHTF.  I've got some sketchy neighborhoods to go through and may need to take a combination of roads, drainage ditches, dry river bed, and railroad tracks, in order to avoid the wrong kind of people. 

I don't like my odds as a refugee and plan to stay close to home, but it's still entertaining to think about how one could best haul a hefty load under their own power.

Quote


I got one of these and have to report that it's a pain in the ass to haul stuff around my backyard, let alone Bug Out with it.  It's a clever idea, but too small for average adults to manage comfortably over long distances.


Quote


I was inspired when I saw this cart on the Rail Riders site a couple years ago......but that guy was pretty miserable for most of his trip, which I think was through Mongolia.

Offline hillclimber

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #10 on: May 26, 2012, 04:10:47 AM »
I think that a lot of folks carry stuff they don't really need. I used to do the same thing, but as I've gotten older I've become more practical. My Get Home Bag weighs less than half what it used to. Start by avoiding large packs. I found with a large pack, I just tended to fill it with stuff that I didn't really need.
Another pitfall is all the tactical stuff. I used to carry all that stuff too, but if you're really expecting a squad level firefight, or zombie invasion, a reality check may be in order. An EMP is a good practical example (although still extreme) of a major scenario where you ride home has just become your own 2 feet. Your big "car kit" isn't making the trip home, and will most likely be scavenged by others.
Imagine that you have to quickly decide which stuff to leave behind. For this reason, there's nothing in my Jeep that I can't walk away from if the need arises. Sure there's some stuff I'd hate to leave, but I have more at home. At worse I'd be out a chain, cheap tools, a Hi-Lift knockoff, etc..
I even stopped carrying a long gun in my vehicle. I just don't think I'd need it.
Then again, I only work a shot distance from home too, and could be home in a few hours walking time.
However, my pack still has enough stuff in it to keep me going for at least a week.
I may not be comfortable, but I'll be alive.
It ain't a camping trip.

Offline Reconnoiter

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #11 on: May 26, 2012, 08:40:30 AM »
What a great thread...  It's worth noting that the people who take survival the most seriously focus on never having to bug out. And it's worth noting that the people who take bug out bags seriously (like my favorite, the guy who runs bugoutbagquest.com - now there's a guy who thinks about BOBs), see BOB's almost entirely as get home bags. The idea that you can take what you need with you for anything more than a couple of days is just the delusion of someone about to become a refugee. Don't mean to piss anyone off, JMHO. :)

That is a worthy note, Medicineball. And you got the point of my post. Thank you!!!

Offline Cedar

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #12 on: May 26, 2012, 09:23:46 AM »
I don't think I am kidding myself. I did SAR for 15 years in all sorts of terrain, in all sorts of weather, usually in the mountains. I was prepared for me for 2 weeks living out of it, my 'found victim' for 72 hours. I now pack 35 pounds every time I hike, which is a 8-10 miler each time I go out, which is usually 2x a week and I am usually in mountainous terrain. I have had a SAR pack since 1990 which I have taken with me or had round me pretty much every day for 22 years, but now it is 'switched up' to be more of a BOB. I use items out of it constantly. If not for me, for someone else. In the last year I have two of them. One for my truck and one which sits my my front door. I know what weight on my back feels like for hours and hours and each hike I do is 500-700+ elevation change. I can carry more than 35 pounds, but it is a slower go and I am not as talkative with it on.

I would prefer to stay home if there is an emergency situation, unless I can't. I have historic unique risks of the following natural hazards here at my home: drought, earthquake, tornado, flood, landslide, volcano, wildfire, windstorm, and severe winter storm. I pretty much have 2 ways in and 2 ways out by vehicle. One or both ways could easily be blocked. One emergency situation could easily set off or trigger another situation at the same time. For instance, if another good sized earthquake happened, the dam which holds 65 acres of water could give away. Which has been a concern since 1960, but engineer people have said it is fine.

High = One incident likely within a 10-35 year period
Moderate = One incident likely within a 35-75 year period
Low = One incident likely within a 75-100 year period


History has shown that my area, earthquake events possibly as large as M9 in the last 3,500 years. County estimates a high probability (see above for what HIGH means) that earthquakes will occur in the future, as well as a high vulnerability to earthquake events. Potential earthquake-related impacts are well-documented in my county, but buildings, dams, transportation systems, utility and communication networks, and lifelines including water, sewer, storm-water and gas lines are particularly at risk. Additionally, damages to roads and water systems will make it difficult to respond to postearthquake fires. The following vulnerabilities / potential impacts were
identified by the city’s steering committee and stakeholders:
  • City Hall is located in an older unreinforced masonry building that houses city government offices and the police department. The steering committee believes that this building could be damaged in the event of an earthquake.
  • 67% of my town's housing was built before 1980. Older homes are at a greater risk of damage from earthquake events. My house is 102 years old.
  • The city’s downtown area houses small businesses, financial institutions, government institutions, and several nonprofits.
    Many historic downtown buildings are comprised of unreinforced masonry, and would likely be vulnerable to high magnitude earthquake events. As shown city’s Cascadia Peril Earthquake Scenario map, 70-100% of the downtown area is likely to be damaged in a high magnitude earthquake event. My escape route is though downtown.
  • The three bridges that cross our creeks/rivers could be vulnerable to seismic activity;
  • Our main industry here (nd my town is only 7,000 people, contains hazardous materials, namely anhydrous ammonia, which if released in an earthquake can harm or kill employees and residents. Local farm stores such also contain large quantities of fertilizer, which when mixed due to an earthquake can cause hazardous gases, potentially harming the environment.
  • The sewage treatment plant could be vulnerable to seismic activity. If damaged, the treatment plant could release raw sewage into our creek, the city’s water source.
  • Utility infrastructure, such as the Verizon switch station, cell phone towers, PGE station, gas lines, and sewer lines could also be damaged in an earthquake event.
  • In 2007, the Department of Geology and Mineral Industries (DOGAMI)conducted a seismic needs assessment for public school buildings, acute inpatient care facilities, fire stations, police stations, sheriffs’ offices, and other law enforcement agency buildings.
    • _____ Middle School: high ( > 10%)
    • _____ Elementary School: high ( > 10%)
    • _____ Elementary School: high ( > 10%)
    • High School: very high (100%)
  • Flooding in town happened in 1964, twice in 1996 and once in 1997. There is a high probability that flooding will occur in the
    future in my town. Thankfully I live in a slightly higher area, than downstream where it flooded before. The town’s wastewater treatment plant lies in the 100-year floodplain, and a flood could both damage the facility and release untreated sewage. Which in turn would compromise our fresh water for the town.
  • If the dam broke, I am in the Inundation area.
  • If there is a landslide from earthquakes or floods, both of our main routes would be cut off. 
  • Volcano issues - Mount Hood and Mount Jefferson are the closest of the cascade volcanoes to my town, and ashfall from Mount Saint Helens has reached my town in the past. Additionally, Mount Adams is located north of Mount Hood, and the Three Sisters lie to the south of Mount Jefferson. The largest eruption of Mount Jefferson occurred between 35,000 and 100,000 years ago, and caused ash to fall as far away as the present-day town of Arco in southeast Idaho. None of our volcanoes here are extinct, just dormant. Mount Hood’s last eruption ended shortly before the arrival of Lewis and Clark in 1805.
  • This town has one recorded wildfire event which occurred in 1865, and burned 988,000 acres. To date, this is Oregon’s largest wildfire. We have a moderate probability that wildfires will occur in the future.
  • We get some wicked windstorms here. History- December 1951 - Winds at 57 mph with gusts measures at 76 mph, caused power outages in my town and closed north and south Santiam highways.
    October 1962 - Columbus Day Storm. Caused 4 injuries in my town, $4 million damages in town, and $8 million damages in the County as a whole. Also wind events in 1971, 1981, 1995, 2002, 2004, 2005, 2 times in 2006, 2008 and this year in 2012. The bank roof got blown off while I have lived here.
  • Since 1957, the County has experienced 5 tornadoes, and several have occurred near my town. In October 1998, a small tornado touched down. In November 1997 and November 1991, tornadoes damaged barns within or near the town. County estimates a high probability that windstorms will occur, and a high vulnerability to windstorm events. Not too far from me, we had a tornado in December 2011, which damaged half the town. Apparently there was a funnel cloud a few days ago.
  • January-February 2008: Record setting snowstorms in my County. 24" of snow in hours. State of emergency declared in the County and surrounding counties. December 2008-2009: Winter storm throughout the Willamette Valley, heavy snow and ice. State of emergency declared in the County and surrounding counties. There is a high probability that severe winter storms will occur in the future, as well as a high vulnerability to such events.

So no, I do not think I am kidding myself with my BOB. I would rather have it and NOT use it, than need it, and not have it.
The one in my truck is because I was tired of schlepping my one pack back and forth while carrying a kid and her supplies to the vehicle. That BOB is to get me home if need be. I have one by my front door as well, as if the air raid siren goes off, it means the dam is compromised. I figure don't have time to get in my vehicle and drive out of town. Which is either TOWARD the dam or down the 'cattle chute', which is where the kazillions of gallons of water will be heading. My plan is to go out my front door and run up the hill which is about a 200 foot climb until there is a bench and then it climbs up again. I figure I have 5 minutes to mostly be up the hill before the water comes. I will do this when I feel ANY shake and not wait for the siren to go off. I will also not come back until the 'ALL Clear' has been sounded. But anything but a backpack is not making it up that hill.

On foot is the worst case scenario. I also have a draft dog who pulls and I can hook him up to the 4 wheeled kid wagon. I will soon have a bike and bike trailer. I have my vehicle. There are options besides being on foot depending on the situational event, but I train on foot with a pack, so I know I can do it.

Cedar

« Last Edit: May 26, 2012, 10:19:03 PM by Archer »

Offline Mr. Bill

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #13 on: May 26, 2012, 01:17:16 PM »
...I'd like to get feedback on the concept of a "BOBOW' (bob on wheels). ...

+1 for a great post!  For some people and some situations, a BOBOW could be an excellent option.

endurance

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #14 on: May 26, 2012, 01:59:25 PM »
Cedar, as always, your posts always impress.  +1

That's one of the most well researched threat assessments I've seen posted.  I've been a bit lazy with mine, but have that luxury (well off the highway, out of the valley, in a geologically stable place with no nuclear power plants within 500 miles, yada, yada, yada) to some degree.  Of course I really should do the local threat assessment and take a poke around. 

In any case, thanks for provoking some thoughts.

Offline Hootie

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #15 on: May 26, 2012, 04:18:00 PM »
First off Cedar, wow. You do your research....
Second, +1 for a great topic Reconnoiter.

I am more a city dweller so the BOBOW is a great idea in my car. Incase I need to walk 55mi on paved roads. If I was off the pavement, that would be another story.

Offline Alan Georges

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #16 on: May 26, 2012, 04:18:29 PM »
Cedar, as always, your posts always impress.  +1
...
In any case, thanks for provoking some thoughts.
Yes Cedar, you do have some very serious events stacked up that could happen in the blink of an eye.  Thanks for writing a thorough analysis – and making me think about my BOB all the harder.

Offline excaliber

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #17 on: May 26, 2012, 04:33:33 PM »
I dont have a BOB, but I keep a get home bag in my truck, under my bed cover, it is a ruck that weights about 35 pounds (lots of water)

I think a cart of some kind is a great idea, for moving stuff to hauling water, or fire wood. I recently done some bartering to get a small wagon (better than nothing) and I got 4 solid foam filled tires for it (no flats). and I really like it for what it is.

a guy wanted a helmet I had, (a copy from the movie troy that Brad Pit wore) and he had several items for trade, and I took the wagon.






my get home bag



« Last Edit: May 26, 2012, 04:45:57 PM by excaliber »

endurance

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #18 on: May 26, 2012, 05:09:03 PM »
If I'm going to go wheeled, I have a BOB trailer.



70 pound capacity and even on mountainous mtb trails I can easily cover 20-25 miles in three to four hours.  On the road, a 70-100 mile day is doable in an eight hour day.

Offline rustyknife

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #19 on: May 26, 2012, 07:00:06 PM »
Good topic  :) It shows once again that one size do not fit all.

In my case my GHB is also my BOB. Since I'm on the road almost all of the time I am already a refugee depending on the circumstances. Under the best of circumstances I could be about 500 miles from home if an event happens that shuts down the road systems to a point that I can not drive. Even if the event is localized and damages bridges and roads to a point that it may be months or even years (hurricane Katrina) before vehicles can be moved, I would not stay with my truck. If there were no other issues and say I could cover about 20 miles a day on foot it would take me about 25 days to make the journey. No way on this earth I could carry 25 days worth of food and supplies.

After years of practicing survival skills, participating in SAR, walking miles and miles with different styles and sizes of BOB's in different types of terrain, my kit has evolved into more of a system of tools that I might use to help me forage my way home as opposed to trying to carry everything I think I might need. The kit I have now is substantially less than the kit I posted on another thread"what's in you BOB and why".

Unfortunately or fortunately, depending on your point of view, my garage looks like a warehouse of used gear and bags. If I buy something it will get field tested several times before it either makes it to the "go" or "no go" pile. On the plus side this has provided me many happy hours of dirt time. ;D

If you are at home I would not recommend to bug out except under the most dire circumstances. But if you are already out like I am then a GHB makes perfect sense.


Offline Reconnoiter

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #20 on: May 26, 2012, 10:36:04 PM »
+1 for a great post!  For some people and some situations, a BOBOW could be an excellent option.

Thank you!!! And you're right, "some people in some situations". I just wanted people to stop and think for a second. "If I really had to bug out, could I carry everything I'd need on my back". Those who can do it, know who they are and I'm not speaking to them. We all aspire to be more "Bear Grylls" like, but most of us just aren't. Plus, the wheel is the single greatest invention of mankind. And like the 4qt. Stainless sauce pan, it's very hard to reproduce in the wild. If you don't need the cart, then dump it, but what if they do? What if your wife breaks her ankle? Now you've got to carry your 35lb pack + her 35lb pack + her?!!! I can, with a BOBOW. I guess I'm just a bit baffled at the push back I got. Oh well :-) thanks again!!!

Offline Reconnoiter

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #21 on: May 26, 2012, 10:46:03 PM »
First off Cedar, wow. You do your research....
Second, +1 for a great topic Reconnoiter.

I am more a city dweller so the BOBOW is a great idea in my car. Incase I need to walk 55mi on paved roads. If I was off the pavement, that would be another story.

Thanks. I'm in the city too. Off road is a tough go, but the 26" x 2.125" wheels do pretty well. Up or down steep terrain, it doesn't work at all. I really don't know how the wagon trains did it. Let's hope we never have to find out :-)

Offline Reconnoiter

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #22 on: May 26, 2012, 10:54:31 PM »

I think a cart of some kind is a great idea, for moving stuff to hauling water, or fire wood. I recently done some bartering to get a small wagon (better than nothing) and I got 4 solid foam filled tires for it (no flats). and I really like it for what it is.





I agree!!! Besides helping me Bug Out, a cart is just a great tool to have in so many situations.

Offline Reconnoiter

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #23 on: May 26, 2012, 11:08:08 PM »
If I'm going to go wheeled, I have a BOB trailer.



70 pound capacity and even on mountainous mtb trails I can easily cover 20-25 miles in three to four hours.  On the road, a 70-100 mile day is doable in an eight hour day.

You're way faster than me. I rode this from San Francisco to San Diego in 6 days, but I rode 12 to 14 hour days.


P1020190 by FilmCrewTech, on Flickr

I've recently started touring with this rig. It's way more comfortable, but you can't cover the same distance, and off-road is out of the question.


IMG_0562 by FilmCrewTech, on Flickr

Offline Reconnoiter

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #24 on: May 26, 2012, 11:19:31 PM »
Good topic  :) It shows once again that one size do not fit all.

In my case my GHB is also my BOB. Since I'm on the road almost all of the time I am already a refugee depending on the circumstances. Under the best of circumstances I could be about 500 miles from home if an event happens that shuts down the road systems to a point that I can not drive. Even if the event is localized and damages bridges and roads to a point that it may be months or even years (hurricane Katrina) before vehicles can be moved, I would not stay with my truck. If there were no other issues and say I could cover about 20 miles a day on foot it would take me about 25 days to make the journey. No way on this earth I could carry 25 days worth of food and supplies.

After years of practicing survival skills, participating in SAR, walking miles and miles with different styles and sizes of BOB's in different types of terrain, my kit has evolved into more of a system of tools that I might use to help me forage my way home as opposed to trying to carry everything I think I might need. The kit I have now is substantially less than the kit I posted on another thread"what's in you BOB and why".

Unfortunately or fortunately, depending on your point of view, my garage looks like a warehouse of used gear and bags. If I buy something it will get field tested several times before it either makes it to the "go" or "no go" pile. On the plus side this has provided me many happy hours of dirt time. ;D

If you are at home I would not recommend to bug out except under the most dire circumstances. But if you are already out like I am then a GHB makes perfect sense.

That's my situation as well. I work in Film Production (Los Angeles Area). I could easily be in San Diego, Las Vegas, or Albuquerque, when trouble hits. So I guess, if I'm close, it's a Get Home Bag. If I'm 1,000 miles away, it's a Make a Home Bag :-)

Offline Cedar

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #25 on: May 27, 2012, 01:49:03 AM »
So I guess, if I'm close, it's a Get Home Bag. If I'm 1,000 miles away, it's a Make a Home Bag :-)

Exactly.

Cedar

Offline hillclimber

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #26 on: May 27, 2012, 06:29:34 AM »
It's a very tough decision to make really.... What to carry, how to carry it, etc..
One size does not fit all in this case, and there is really no right, or wrong answer.
I can't imagine the city dwellers outlook on this topic. In my case, there's almost nothing that would force me from my home. I've lived here all my life, and know the area really well. I know of only one realistic scenario, that might force me to leave, and that would most likely be temporary.
Up here, it would be quite some time before I would have any trouble with people, in the city, I imagine it would be a different story.

Offline Nadir_E

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #27 on: May 27, 2012, 08:12:59 AM »
I'll echo earlier comments about this being a thought-provoking thread and also give another nod to Cedar's very well thought out threat assessment.

My initial thoughts when you posted about the idea of a cart over a bag was two-fold, first, the Mormons did this a long time ago -
  and it sure looked unpleasant.

My second thought was a line I hear attributed to a SF soldier many years ago, "Replace gear with skill whenever possible."  The point being that we will go gadget / gear crazy and completely overload ourselves while all around us are either scavenge-able items or versions that can be made from nature's supplies.  As noted earlier, everyone's location and situation is different, so this angle will have different value for each of us (for example here in Southern California versus Minnesota's UP).

Because of the limits of what can be taken on planes, my bag and approach is "get home" when I'm in California, and I will have to rely solely on skill, bartering, and scavenging if I'm in another city (without transportation).  Even if an earth-quake destroys my home, I still plan to "bug in" since the weather here is mild enough that it would become a back yard camping trip that doubles as looter-deterrent duty.

-N
« Last Edit: May 30, 2012, 07:16:49 PM by Roknrandy »

Offline Ian Adams

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #28 on: May 27, 2012, 10:05:25 AM »
I wonder if some type of rolling cart wouldn't make one a more obvious, and vulnerable, target?

Offline Reconnoiter

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Re: Are we kidding ourselves with our Bug Out Bags?
« Reply #29 on: May 27, 2012, 10:25:53 AM »
It's a very tough decision to make really.... What to carry, how to carry it, etc..
One size does not fit all in this case, and there is really no right, or wrong answer.
I can't imagine the city dwellers outlook on this topic. In my case, there's almost nothing that would force me from my home. I've lived here all my life, and know the area really well. I know of only one realistic scenario, that might force me to leave, and that would most likely be temporary.
Up here, it would be quite some time before I would have any trouble with people, in the city, I imagine it would be a different story.

There's no doubt, living where you would want to be in tough times is the best solution. I'm working on it :-)