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Author Topic: First time gas storage tips  (Read 3303 times)

Offline Lobo

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First time gas storage tips
« on: November 15, 2012, 11:40:12 AM »
After watching all the youtube videos of people waiting in line, violence irrupting in lines, people getting arrested because they are hording gas; what a nightmare! Well I went out and bought some gas containers because if I have bug out because of a natural disaster or SHTF scenario I don't want not having enough gas to get out of town to be a factor anymore. I have 2x 5 gallon cans, and my 3 gallon can for my lawnmower; which I always try to keep full even if it's just a gallon refill.  So I have 13 gallons of gas ready to go in my garage. I also bought Sta-bil and have put that in my 5 gallon containers.  Since this is the first time I've ever stored gas can y'all (yes I live in Texas, San Antonio  8) ) give me storage tips and/or let me know of any potential opportunities I could have? Here's a picture of what I have. I also bought a siphon pump if I needed to scavenge or probably more realistically if one of the spouts broke I could still get the gas out in a safe manner.



Should I just leave them on the ground?
Should I store them outside?
I have something like this outside that my gas containers could easily fit in.
http://www.homedepot.com/Storage-Organization-Sheds-Garages-Outdoor-Storage-Deck-Boxes/h_d1/N-5yc1vZbtz1/R-203273777/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&storeId=10051#.UKUojoZaOSo
Should I be worried about the fumes building up in my garage?
And what about the danger of a fire/explosion happening because of it being stored?

Thanks for the help TSP!
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Offline meapplejak

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2012, 12:19:11 PM »
Good questions.  Tagging for future responses.  I think elevating them is a good idea like on a shelf out of the sun is good.

What about an outdoor shed?  Anyone have opinions. 

Is evap that bad my family always kept them in the garage near the bottom shelf not sure how wise that is.
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Offline Cordovil

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2012, 12:26:39 PM »
Definitely listen to this episode, if you haven't already:

http://www.thesurvivalpodcast.com/harris-on-fuel-storage

Most important point is that the storage cans should be closed tight enough that there isn't any evaporation, and so no fumes.  Not sure if the cans you have are good in that respect or not, hopefully others with more experience can comment as I'm interested to know as well.  I suspect if you just store that small amount, and maybe each month empty a can into your vehicle and fill up the can with fresh gas, you will be OK even if there is some evaporation. 

I probably wouldn't be worried about fumes from that small amount building up in my garage, unless the cans are really poorly closed.

Offline Lobo

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2012, 12:56:16 PM »
@meapplejak: I thought about putting them on a shelf above the ground. This may sound stupid but should I be worried about static electricity? So which material for a shelf would be best, plastic, wood, or metal? And great point about keeping them out of the sun. If I did keep them outside in my patio storage box they wouldn't be in the sun but they would get hot in the Texas sun! Anyone have some suggestions for shelf storage?

@ Cordovil: Thanks for pointing out that podcast; will definitely listen to it.
I did make sure that I screwed the nozzles on pretty tight because I was concerned about fumes and also if someone bumped them that gas wouldn't leak out, etc. I know that the 5 gallon steel nato cans would be the way to go but they are average $45 - $50 bucks each! I know these cans aren't the strongest cans but at least I've got some gas storage, something is better than nada right? Down the road I want to get some of those nato gas can though.  Is rotating them monthly a minimum ya think? Or can I go longer? That Sta-bil says it'll keep the gas good for up to 12 months. 
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Offline Cordovil

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2012, 01:02:35 PM »
Is rotating them monthly a minimum ya think? Or can I go longer? That Sta-bil says it'll keep the gas good for up to 12 months.

One month was just my off-the-cuff guess.  You're right that the Sta-bil will keep the gas good for 12 months, but I think that's assuming a good seal (i.e. no evaporation).  I'm not sure though.  I don't know, for example, how much help Sta-bil will provide if you have lots of evaporation from those cans.  That's why I suggested 1 month rotation, which hopefully is frequent enough to keep your gas fresh but infrequent enough to not be a hassle.

Maybe every 3 months (e.g. first day of winter, first day of spring . . .) would be just as good.

Offline Lobo

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2012, 01:28:34 PM »
@Cordovil: I don't want to be absent minded with it so I do agree with you on rotating and refilling. I don't want to be in a situation where I HAVE to bug out and one of them is half full, they're cracked and start leaking when I put them in my suv, etc. But I don't want to start adding an extra monthly expense either. So I guess I just need to find a nice balance. Every 3 months sound pretty good or maybe I can space each can out so it's not a $50 pop each time to refill.  Can you think of a clever way I can write on each can to let me know when was the last time I refilled it? I was thinking one of those Chinese grease markers.
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Offline Hootie

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2012, 04:44:59 PM »
while the "red cans" are a good temp solution for me. I think 15 gal drums and a good bung wrench to tighten them down (to seal them up. is the way to go.  No more fumes in the garage and better for long term quality.

you can find the transcript for Ep 980 Fuel storage, here:
http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=37923.0
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Offline excaliber

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2012, 07:19:51 PM »
is stay-bil the best stuff out there for increasing the shelf life?

Offline Datman01

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #8 on: November 15, 2012, 08:42:03 PM »
Take Hootie and Cordovil's advice and listen to the Steven Harris podcasts.  The red containers don't seal up well enough for long term storage.

Offline Ronin4hire

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #9 on: November 16, 2012, 09:17:31 AM »
Ive kept a rotation of 5gal containers with Stabil in the corner of my garage, with longest pushing 6-8mo til use.
The 15g barrels sealed up solid would be better for LONGER term storage.
Id also try that PRI? stuff mentioned by Steve & Jack in the episode for this.

Offline Mountain State Prepper

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #10 on: November 16, 2012, 09:36:04 AM »
while the "red cans" are a good temp solution for me. I think 15 gal drums and a good bung wrench to tighten them down (to seal them up. is the way to go.  No more fumes in the garage and better for long term quality.

you can find the transcript for Ep 980 Fuel storage, here:
http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=37923.0


The 15 gallon drums are working for me too.   No odor or fumes in the garage, put them in the back against the wall and out of the way.  I like the 15 gallon size b/c I can move them around easily myself.    One fills up the our SUV, two fill up my truck (almost).   I've sunk about $250 in total into my fuel preps (including the gas, drums, stabilizer, bung wrench).   

It hasn't been long enough for me to rotate, but I'm thinking now, every 6 months or so?   And now the costs are minimal.   I wait until the truck is half empty, use a 15 gallon drum, put it in the back...go fill it up.    Other than the small inconvience of filling the drum and moving it in and out of the bed of the truck, my fuel costs are now back to normal.



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Offline Moonvalleyprepper

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #11 on: November 16, 2012, 09:42:32 AM »
Every 3 months sound pretty good or maybe I can space each can out so it's not a $50 pop each time to refill.  Can you think of a clever way I can write on each can to let me know when was the last time I refilled it? I was thinking one of those Chinese grease markers.

+1 to listening to the Steve Harris podcast on fuel storage.

When you rotate your fuel storage, take the gas from the drum and put it in your car. Then take the money you would spend for gas for your car and put that gas in the drum. Your only spending the extra $50 a pop the first time you fill them up, after that you just buying the same amount of fuel you normally use.

For labeling you could always go the classy route of masking tape and sharpie.
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Offline GreekMan

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2012, 03:10:56 PM »
guys i go to ask...
How good are steel barrels -used to store motor oil and other chemicals- for gasoline storage?
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Offline tink20seven

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2012, 09:17:56 PM »
guys i go to ask...
How good are steel barrels -used to store motor oil and other chemicals- for gasoline storage?

I imagine they'd be just fine, but came here to ask a similar question...

We haved stored gas in red / blue / yellow PE cans before and know what to expect there.  METAL cans however, are something new to me.

I recently picked up a couple of Briggs & Stratton all metal 5 Gal. gas cans.



Was thinking about storing them underground, but until I dig that hole they'll be sitting outside in a wood box.

Any thoughts on special precautions I should take?  Are there any negatives to this type of container?

Offline Garandman

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #14 on: November 19, 2012, 11:23:20 AM »
is stay-bil the best stuff out there for increasing the shelf life?
the Podcast referenced refers to PRI-G. It is commonly found in marine stores.

The debate between users of Sta-Bil Marine Ethanol Formula, PRI-G, and StarTron has taken on almost religious momentum. I've used all three with good results, although I rotate everything out in a year or less.


Offline PrepperJim

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #15 on: November 19, 2012, 02:01:02 PM »
All - I hate to keep bringing this up, but I disagreed with Steven Harris regarding his storage proposal. So that I don't have to cut and paste from previous threads, I created a blog post:

http://winterant.com/home.html/2012/10/gas-storage-pt-3/

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Offline tink20seven

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #16 on: November 19, 2012, 03:25:54 PM »

http://winterant.com/home.html/2012/10/gas-storage-pt-3/


Thanks very much for this informative post.  Definitely helped me understand why the 15 gal HDPE barrels may not be the answer.

Regarding the metal "jerry cans", any special precautions?  Is static charge an issue?

Offline BiggBake

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #17 on: November 19, 2012, 08:04:07 PM »
Great thread!  I just picked up some military style 5 gal. plastic fuel cans from a surplus store.  They are thick plastic and seal well.  I will be storing 25 gallons of deisel.  I plan on rotating one can a month into my vehicle to keep the fuel fresh.  Thanks!

Offline roger123

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #18 on: November 22, 2012, 02:46:50 PM »
@Cordovil: I don't want to be absent minded with it so I do agree with you on rotating and refilling. I don't want to be in a situation where I HAVE to bug out and one of them is half full, they're cracked and start leaking when I put them in my suv, etc. But I don't want to start adding an extra monthly expense either. So I guess I just need to find a nice balance. Every 3 months sound pretty good or maybe I can space each can out so it's not a $50 pop each time to refill.  Can you think of a clever way I can write on each can to let me know when was the last time I refilled it? I was thinking one of those Chinese grease markers.

I use the blue painters tape and write on it with a sharpie when they were filled and if I added Stabil.

Easy to remove when you re-fill the container.

Offline PrepperJim

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #19 on: November 22, 2012, 04:57:35 PM »
Thanks very much for this informative post.  Definitely helped me understand why the 15 gal HDPE barrels may not be the answer.

Regarding the metal "jerry cans", any special precautions?  Is static charge an issue?

Metal does rust if the cans are dented. I don't worry much about static. Falling liquid will build it up so I fill the cans on the ground not in the back of a truck. This goes for plastic as well.
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Offline flippydidit

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #20 on: November 22, 2012, 10:24:45 PM »
Very informative so far.  From our experience a 6 month rotation is fine.  We choose to "stabilize" our fuel.  The stabilizer is mostly alcohol, and is intended to drive water from the fuel.  If you live in an arid (low humidity) area, and stay away from the ethanol blended gasoline, you might not need to "stabilize" the fuel.

As for keeping the drums/barrels/cans full or not, PrepperJim has the right approach.  You need room for the vapors to expand (a check valve is ideal).  Having more than his recommended 10% head by volume can lead to other issues.  The "explosive" nature of gasoline is more dangerous and likely from vapors than liquid.  Allowing more than 10% of your storage to be in vapor form (potentially) is something I would avoid.  So to address your safety concerns, I'd do the following:

1)  Keep your fuel containers either full (minus 10% or less for expansion of vapors) or empty.
2)  Keep them cool and out of the direct sunlight.  Fuel is fuel, but kept well below it's combustion temperature is where the safety lies.  Especially since vapor is formed at higher temperatures.
3)  Be careful with static electricity.  Fill them on the ground, and understand that metal on metal threads can generate static electricity and/or sparks.
4)  Keep your fuel dry and "clean".  Water or ethanol in your fuel will ruin it for long term use.
5)  Protect your investment.  Avoid laying them on their sides or unnecessarily jostling the containers.  Have a plan for where they are stored and keep them there.

Hope this helps!
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Offline doublehelix

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #21 on: November 22, 2012, 11:56:56 PM »
PRI-G (Shellsol D60 based according to the MSDS) is much, much better than Sta-Bil (mostly mineral oil according to the MSDS) by leaps and bounds.

I've been using it for years with very good results.  Sta-Bil not so much, which is why I abandoned it.

StarTron (enzyme based) is something that the commercial boating community is starting to view pretty favorably.

Good resource site on fuel treatment additive contents:
http://www.fuel-testers.com/review_gas_treatment_products.html

Primary thing is to keep it cool, and keep oxygen and light away from it.


Offline Neilsan

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #22 on: January 24, 2013, 12:26:07 AM »
Any tips on where to get gasoline safe bung gaskets? Actually, something that I would pay through the nose for, is caps that I can put on my lawn mower gas can, that don't have an O-ring seal valve. Just a solid cap that would seal that bad boy up, and I'll just duct tape those flimsy nozzle caps to the side or something.

Offline Hootie

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #23 on: January 24, 2013, 11:50:09 AM »
Any tips on where to get gasoline safe bung gaskets?

Good question. The place I get the barrels in WI give white foam ones for each bung. Next time I get a barrel I will ask for a few extra and see if they dissolve in gas.
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Offline stationjj

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #24 on: February 01, 2013, 09:22:25 PM »
I have been storing gasoline for over a few years now.  I haven't had any issues at all.  I have burned the fuel in my generator and car.

I purchased Metal Jerry Cans.  I got from Northern Tool, but they don't carry them anymore.  Oddly the Company that made them blitzusa.com does even show them on there web site.

I filled them with 93 Octane Gas only.  I also used ethanol free gas if I could find it.  Very hard.  Few stations claim they have ethanol free gas.
I used Pri-G additive instead of Sta-Bil.  I read where Pri-G works better for long term storage.

I store the jerry cans on a metal rack about 6 inches off the floor in my garage.  Storing in the garage may not be ideal for everyone.  My garage faces west so it get most of the heat in the afternoon.  I also insulated my garage doors.  I think this helps a lot.  I also vent garage during summer to help reduce heat build up.

I try and rotate my fuel by adding it to my car.  I always mix the stored fuel with fresh fuel in my car.

I have also test long term stored fuel in generator as well.  I test my generator every three months.

My setup was worked well for me for a few years now.

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Offline Lobo

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #25 on: March 18, 2013, 12:42:01 AM »
Been MIA for a while. But just wanted to let those know that have replied to this threat about my gas storage.

But I did use my gas storage after 3 months of my gas cans sitting in the garage, used Stalbil on them. I had not issues with the gas as far as my cars running on them.

The only thing that was a little annoying was that one of the cans did leak a little bit when I was pouring it into the gas tank; around the seal of the gas nozzle. But not like a major leak, just a little bit. And once the gas was about half way through it stopped leaking.


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Offline FoolishCop

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #26 on: March 21, 2013, 09:01:50 PM »
I also began storing gasoline after Hurricane Sandy and currently have 50 gal. stored in 5 gal. red plastic cans. I plan on getting 2 more cans to give me 60 gal. in 12 cans. I added Stabil to them, but subsequently red that if the gas is being used in a year's time or less it's not necessary.

My goal is to constantly rotate them one every month, pouring the gas into my truck, generator, or lawn mower as needed and then refilling it and putting it at the end of the line.
 
Am what I reading here suggesting I do need a stabilizer, and optimally, a metal can instead of the plastic ones?

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Offline GreekMan

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #27 on: March 22, 2013, 11:59:06 AM »
inded cos you will gasoline over evaporation, and i guess you will be lossing the more volatile (smaller) hydrocarbons.
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Offline quickbear

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #28 on: March 22, 2013, 04:04:12 PM »
I started storing some gasoline about 6 months ago.  I have had the red plastic gas cans in the past and was never a fan as they didn't seem to seal up very well, would leak if knocked over and send out vapors.  I found some affordable metal 5 gallon cans at a local drum and barrell supply place.  They seemed uncomfortable when i kept referring to them as "gas cans" instead calling them "fuel cans", what is that about?  Anyhow, they look like this: http://www.houseofcans.com/gallon-closed-head-pullout-spout-rust-inhibitor-lined-approved-p-1222-l-en.html

My review so far having rotated them all once now (I keep 4 cans for 20 gallons of fuel) is that they seal up perfectly with no odor and no leaking when turned on their side.  I keep them outside on paver bicks and covered with shade cloth to avoid rusting and full sun  exposure.  the downside is that they are really hard to pour out and seem to make a mess as the spout does not seal up at the base.  They also have started to rust some on the bottoms so I will have to keep an eye on this and scrap them eventually. I took to using a red plastic 5 gallon can to actually fill up my vehicle as the spout is better for a gas tank. Which means I have to transfer the gas twice to get it into the car.  Overall I would give them a C rating or 6 out of ten.  If you are on a budget they are a good option costing only about $15 each and I would feel very confident keeping them inside a building which is not an option for me.
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Offline PrepperJim

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Re: First time gas storage tips
« Reply #29 on: March 22, 2013, 06:11:25 PM »
Anyhow, they look like this: http://www.houseofcans.com/gallon-closed-head-pullout-spout-rust-inhibitor-lined-approved-p-1222-l-en.html

 They also have started to rust some on the bottoms so I will have to keep an eye on this and scrap them eventually. I took to using a red plastic 5 gallon can to actually fill up my vehicle as the spout is better for a gas tank. Which means I have to transfer the gas twice to get it into the car.  Overall I would give them a C rating or 6 out of ten.  If you are on a budget they are a good option costing only about $15 each and I would feel very confident keeping them inside a building which is not an option for me.

Yeah. Rust is a bitch. They really should not rust so fast if they are coated well enough. If they are stout as the link (UN1A1/Y1.8/240 is the designation), they can take a lot of pressure. That really is a tough container.

Do your cans have a similar marking?
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