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Author Topic: Survival wagon  (Read 2077 times)

Offline Wildthang

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Survival wagon
« on: November 21, 2012, 10:05:21 AM »
I was hanging out in mt shop / mancave the other day, and got to looking at my little Gorilla yard cart. It has a plastic bed, steel frame, pretty fat pneumatic tires, and the front wheels turn with the direction of the pull handle. It pulls very easily and will haul up to 300lbs if my memory serves me correctly.
So then I started thinking that if I ever had to leave the roads, and bug out far into the woods, that little wagon would carry a heck of a lot of stuff that I couldn't carry otherwise.
It would also float like a little boat if you had to cross a stream, and it is narrow enough to manuver through the woods except in underbrush thickette type conditions. It would also be easy to put dual wheels on it for more flotation and more stability on snow and in the mud, and not bog down from the weight.
Now the last thing I am going to do is try to pull 300lbs on a wagon throught the wilderness, but 100lbs wouldn't be bad, and a person could get a lot of supplies to the BOL that you normally couldn't take.
It would also be good to collect wood and water in after you got there!
So am I just nuts............don't answer that, or does this all make good sense?


Offline fritz_monroe

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #1 on: November 21, 2012, 10:10:50 AM »
Yep, makes sense.  I would also look at rigging up some sort of harness so you didn't have to pull it by hand.  Put on the shoulder straps, connect to the wagon and pull away.  It would leave your hands free for other stuff like a weapon or helping someone up.  Of course it would have to be easily disconnected in case you had to drop and run or the wagon started pulling you down a hill.
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Offline Nicodemus

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #2 on: November 21, 2012, 10:21:14 AM »
I have a Gorilla Dump Cart rated up to 1200 pounds that I have at the ready for a BOB Trailer that I can pull on foot or by bike.

One of the problems that I've noted so far is that when loaded with anything above a couple hundred pounds it gets very hard to keep from moving on even the smallest grade. You have to cut diagonally across grades to keep it under control.

Another problem is those pneumatic tires. They're low to the ground and the center of gravity on the cart tends to be high. This becomes a problem when you cut across slopes as mentioned above. The cart wants to tip over. Not only that, but when you pick up any speed and start hitting small bumps, those tires get very bouncy and the cart tends to bounce wildly. A third factor which is a problem is that the tires are relatively small in comparison to the whole wagon and it can be hard to mantle objects such as rocks, tree roots and bumps if they're too large.

So, my advice would be to keep the load down to a manageable weight even if you've got the ability to carry more.

I plan on getting someone to weld an attachment in the middle of the frame into which I can add bearings and through which I can run an axle to attach bicycle tires. It will drastically reduce the load capacity, but it will allow more control.


Offline flippydidit

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #3 on: November 21, 2012, 10:40:55 AM »
If you aren't too fixed on the yard cart and want to look at different options, I'd look at a deer cart.  Like this:

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/guide-gear-deer-cart.aspx?a=351879

There is also an aluminum version, but I'd imagine the steel one would be easier to "modify" should some....uh...welding need to be done....

We used some like this in the Army and we made quick release straps that attached to our web belts (this kept our hands available for other uses).  We called them our "tactical rickshaws".  They worked awesome, were very stable, and as long as you didn't overload it you wouldn't be under the cart's control.  In hindsight, I probably could have installed caliper brakes on it to assist me on the downhill grades.  Hmmmm.....
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Offline Texas Sawduster

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #4 on: November 21, 2012, 11:18:33 AM »
If you plan on using a "CART" of any type, really consider attaching a harness of some type so that you can use your full body to pull the cart.
It is alot easier than using a handle and one arm to pull as you will put a twisting type moment of intertia on your back and neck muscles.

I would also practice your wagon/cart plan out in the woods if possible so you can find what issues you may have with pulling the cart.

Great Idea by the way.

I would add more tires.

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Offline ncjeeper

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #5 on: November 21, 2012, 12:18:53 PM »
Heres my wagon I take to swap meets.

I guess I could pull it with me if the zombies come.  :)
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Offline Wildthang

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #6 on: November 21, 2012, 01:18:23 PM »
If you aren't too fixed on the yard cart and want to look at different options, I'd look at a deer cart.  Like this:

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/guide-gear-deer-cart.aspx?a=351879

There is also an aluminum version, but I'd imagine the steel one would be easier to "modify" should some....uh...welding need to be done....

We used some like this in the Army and we made quick release straps that attached to our web belts (this kept our hands available for other uses).  We called them our "tactical rickshaws".  They worked awesome, were very stable, and as long as you didn't overload it you wouldn't be under the cart's control.  In hindsight, I probably could have installed caliper brakes on it to assist me on the downhill grades.  Hmmmm.....

Yeah Nick that all makes good sense, and exactly why I would not try to pull more than 100 lbs. I have had 200 lbs in it before and it gets hard to pull at that point. I will also look into adding a small disc brake from a lawnmower or go cart on the rear axle for down hill ascents. I can keep 100lbs of stuff farily low in the bed which hopefully will help the top heavy issue as well.
I actually thought about putting a sheet metal skid plate under it so it would tend to slide over logs and rocks instead of just hanging up. Above the skid plate might be a good place to mount small sealed 12 volt battery for lights and charging phones etc.
Maybe we should design the supreme bug out wagon and patent them!

Offline Cedar

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #7 on: November 21, 2012, 05:13:33 PM »
Which is why I have 12 sled dog harnesses still.



I have a 4 wheeled wagon I can hook my current dog up to. And will in a possible scenerio for needing to haul extra gear.

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Offline Joe_Nobody

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #8 on: November 21, 2012, 07:29:39 PM »
I think the wagon is a solid option.

I've recommended folks use a golf bag caddy as well. Big wheels, cheap, designed to go overland, light, folds up..etc...etc.

There's no rule that says we all have to be special forces and hump 120lbs on our backs all day. I don't know about ya'all, but I did my share of that and I have the cranky, creeky knees to prove it. I would pull a pink Barbie wagon along if my butt was on the line.


Offline nelson96

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #9 on: November 21, 2012, 07:46:20 PM »
Being that I'm a hunter, I prefer the Game Cart.  Maybe not the one pictured but this idea.  You could even include attachments to allow it to be towed by an ATV, horse, bicycle, etc. . . .  Not to mention all kinds of game, but I've used them to hump all kinds of stuff in to the wilderness when motorized options were not allowed.

http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=35455.msg406224#msg406224

If you must load up heavy, I recommend the durability of the "game cart".  The large diameter wheels make it easier to go over large obstacles.  Below is an example of a foldable cart made out of aluminum, but they come in many shapes, designs, and sizes.

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Offline flippydidit

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #10 on: November 21, 2012, 10:56:25 PM »
Which is why I have 12 sled dog harnesses still.



I have a 4 wheeled wagon I can hook my current dog up to. And will in a possible scenerio for needing to haul extra gear.

Cedar

Cedar,

How do your dogs behave around gunfire?  I'd hate for you to have a yard sale all the way up the road if they bolted.

Otherwise I would love to see the beautiful Queen Cedar being pulled in her carriage by those dogs while she picks off the zombies!  That would be awesome!
Nate
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Offline Cedar

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #11 on: November 21, 2012, 11:24:06 PM »
Cedar,
How do your dogs behave around gunfire?  I'd hate for you to have a yard sale all the way up the road if they bolted.

They are perfectly fine. They were pretty 'bombproof', although after being for 3 days out in the wilderness and then coming up to a turn where there were people, they would shy off, but keep going forward, just give the people a wide berth depending on who I had on lead. My team was unique as I had 4 leaders out of 6 dogs most of the time. If "Tasha" was in the lead, she was a house pet, so she was happy to see people. If "Soda" was up front, she avoided people.

Otherwise I would love to see the beautiful Queen Cedar being pulled in her carriage by those dogs

I sent you 2 videos of me/my team my friends took. Not sure about the beautiful part. Or the Royalty part.

Cedar
« Last Edit: November 21, 2012, 11:31:21 PM by Cedar »
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Offline flippydidit

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #12 on: November 22, 2012, 12:07:25 AM »

I sent you 2 videos of me/my team my friends took. Not sure about the beautiful part. Or the Royalty part.

Cedar

I don't know if it already exists, but I'm seriously contemplating a Florida "modified" dog "sled" team.

As far as royalty, you look pretty dignified to me in those videos.  When compared to the poor bastards that are going to be pushing shopping carts and pulling red wagons, I'd say you are downright monarch material.
Nate
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Offline Cedar

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #13 on: November 22, 2012, 12:39:48 AM »
I don't know if it already exists, but I'm seriously contemplating a Florida "modified" dog "sled" team.

Yes, it is called "drylanding".


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOSPdDqPEUo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=oZkERXxfclc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9L8gLkRCUqI&feature=relmfu

Dang mud http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9L8gLkRCUqI&feature=relmfu But this will give you a bit of the thrill of being in the drivers seat. And yeah, you go faster on snow.

I don't know how far you can go drylanding as I gave my dogs the summers off. It will depend on their conditioning and how hot/humid it is. Know that sled dogs can burn 14,000 k/cals a day and I presume that drylander dogs do too. A house dogs burns 500-800k/cals a day in comparison. With my sled dogs I would get about 30 miles out of them in about 4 hours or so depending on the temp/steepness of the countryside. Some of my friends who were professional mushers would get 100+ miles a day.

The dogs will overheat downhill more than uphill, so you have to govern them running down slopes and not let them go full tilt. You also have to be in shape. The first day I ran sled dogs I did a 10 miler and I had to roll onto the floor the next morning and then use the bed to haul me upright. That was for two days and I could barely move. I also was in very good physical condition then, just not using those particular muscles in my life apparently. You do alot of running and balancing too. It is very much a team effort and just not on the dogs part.

In FL I would suggest NOT northern breeds of dogs. Get slick coated dogs with prick ears and have them wear boots on long runs after they toughen their feet up.

Oh.. and make sure you have at least 2 brake systems.. and NEVER EVER let go of the sled/cart.... EVER.

Cedar

PS Here is a better one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN-J5skUVFE&feature=channel&list=UL

« Last Edit: November 22, 2012, 12:46:20 AM by Cedar »
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Offline nelson96

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #14 on: November 22, 2012, 12:40:51 AM »
As far as royalty, you look pretty dignified to me in those videos.  When compared to the poor bastards that are going to be pushing shopping carts and pulling red wagons, I'd say you are downright monarch material.

I can see it . . .  Cedar driving the sled with Z kick'n it up front jam'n out My Sweet Blue Eyed Darlin.
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Offline Cedar

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Re: Survival wagon
« Reply #15 on: November 22, 2012, 01:03:08 AM »
I like it!!!

Cedar
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