Author Topic: good budget backup gun suggestions?  (Read 1876 times)

Offline Erigorn

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good budget backup gun suggestions?
« on: January 13, 2013, 09:14:36 PM »
I feel my basic arsenal is OK with a 12 gauge shotgun, AK, .22, and 9mm pistol. My question is what are some suggestions for some backup guns. Specifically budget friendly ones that might make good guns to store in a cache or something if guns are lost, stolen, etc. I guess probably an all purpose rifle and maybe pistol too. Keeping same caliber would be good but not required.

Some I've thought or heard of are the mosen nagant, hi point brands (model unknown) used is probably best due to budget and such.

Thanks.

Offline mvrck

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2013, 09:30:26 PM »
I suggest getting another copy of one you already own. Then, you have spares, can use the same ammo and are already familiar with it...
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Offline NWPilgrim

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2013, 10:45:47 PM »
I take it you are looking for guns cheap enough you can buy multiples and that you would not cry if one got rusted out by leaky seal or something, correct?

A Mosin is attractive in that it is cheap and you can still get cheap ammo for it, though it is FMJ. Downside is that many are not accurate especially with surplus ammo.  Probably minute of bad guy at 100 yds but I would not count on any further unless you test it yourself.  A friend has one that shoots about 6" groups at 100 yds. And he says it seems to kick much more than his Garand (bolt action versus gas of course). SKS used to fit this categiory but I have heard those prices are now up around $400-$500.

Another option might be a used NEF Handi Rifle. Single shot but cheap and get it in most common any caliber.  For .22LR you might look at the Marlin 60.  I bought one for little over $100 and it is tube magazine so no need to worry about loosing the mag. A used one might run even less.

I've run into a couple of guys at the range with high point carbine and pistol.  I was surprised at their decent accuracy.  They are bulky compared to other guns in those calibers, but I think they paid like $150 for each.  I saw them shoot several boxes of 9mm and .40 and they had no problems. Something worth looking in to.

Whatever you get, consider the total cost of the gun plus any mags and ammo along with what you expect it to do.  If I am caching them just to give me temporary protection until I can save and purchase something more permanent then the Mosin, Handi, or  Marlin 60 may be very good for that.  But if you are caching them as a fall back because you had to escape quickly and home is destroyed, or you cannot get back to your home, and you are concerned a ban of new guns might be in place, then you might want to consider duplicates of what you already have since they then ecome your permanent defense.
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Offline PistolWhipped

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2013, 11:21:13 PM »
I feel my basic arsenal is OK with a 12 gauge shotgun, AK, .22, and 9mm pistol. My question is what are some suggestions for some backup guns. Specifically budget friendly ones that might make good guns to store in a cache or something if guns are lost, stolen, etc. I guess probably an all purpose rifle and maybe pistol too. Keeping same caliber would be good but not required.

Some I've thought or heard of are the mosen nagant, hi point brands (model unknown) used is probably best due to budget and such.

Thanks.

Nice battery. Looks a hell of a lot like mine. Now, buy duplicates.  I am a man of meager means myself.  Meaning I can't buy new stuff until I get something that works.  Shop for value, not specifically price.  A $125 Locrin in .25 ACP is a cheap gun.  But not a good value.  My Mosin Nagant 91/30 however, will put Barnaul 175gr Match into a IPSC silhouette at 450 yards or a good day.  I made sure to check them out at the store and got one with a nearly pristine bore.  Bolt is clunky, trigger is mediocre, but it hits what I point at.  It was the best $120 I ever spent on a rifle.

My defensive handgun is a used Glock.  Yeah, I could have gotten a used Taurus automatic or revolver or even a Hi Point cheaper.  And it probably would have sufficed.  Most of the time.  For most things.  My ass, and those of my friends and family, was worth the extra money though.

If you want a good, cheap, general purpose rifle, you need to assess your area, your likely needs (more defensive, hunting, strictly "survival") and go from there. 

I live in one of the few places in my area you can see more than 300 yards on all sides.  So a full power bolt action makes sense, for hunting and longer ranged problems.  My Mosin serves the role ably for now, but there are other options on the horizon.  If I were going with inexpensive, even a $300 Stevens 200 with a decent scope would run maybe $450 total, and with the right caliber/load would extend my dangerous range a few hundred yards out.  It's cheap enough not to pamper, and has all the advantages of the Savage action (i.e. Cheap, accurate, easy to tinker with).  Now, I'd PREFER and would LOOK TO INVEST IN a PTR91 myself, but there is a certain balance between getting good gear and spending more time saving than having.

Anywhere outside of my property, and something with reduced range, recoil and price of ammo would be a better investment.  An uncle of mine kept a loded Winchester Model 94 behind the seat of his truck for most of his life.  Never ran into a problem it wouldn't have solved.  Lever actions in both rifle and pistol calibers make fairly good general usage weapons, for both hunting and defense, and often for much less expense than a semi-auto or premium bolt action.

The term "General Purpose" rifle leaves a lot unexamined.  Where do  you live? What problems would you possibly face?  Someone living in Alaskan bear country will have a different "General Purpose Rifle" than I do in the wetlands of North Carolina.  A semi-auto .308 could do it all serviceably, but there are plenty of places that would be illegal.  More if the AWB passes.

Offline Erigorn

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2013, 12:13:22 AM »
Thanks for the replies. Gives me somewhere to start. I hope i get a few more to chime in here.

For clarification I feel comfortable with what I have now. I would like a few that would serve specifically as backup in case I no longer had access to mine. (Could be lost, stolen, confiscated) Something that could provide me some self defense and/or hunting.  Duplicates of what i have right now is out the budget. They would most likely be stored or cached at a bug out location or buried or otherwise hidden.

I have heard in passing mention of budget friendly shotguns. But i don't recall brand. A shotgun may be a better option than a rifle since it can potentially be more versatile. So if you have shotgun advice as well please share.

Offline 16onRockandRoll

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #5 on: January 14, 2013, 12:21:33 AM »
Maverick has the model 88 that is a pretty close copy of the Mossberg 500, and can be had pretty inexpensively. The 7+1, 20" bbl one is less than $300 new, and other variations are cheaper. My brother got that one, and I think it is an awesome package for the money. If I wasn't looking for my next shotgun to be another 20ga, I would probably pick one up just to have it.
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—Jeff Cooper, The Art of the Rifle

Offline flippydidit

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #6 on: January 14, 2013, 01:50:09 AM »
So far this has been a great discussion with lots of good advice.  I'll make the following recommendations.

1.  Put the word out to relatives that you'd like to pick up another firearm.  Maybe Uncle Bob has a gun he doesn't need and wants to sell it to you for a good price.  Many relatives are happy to see their nephews/grand-kids are interested in shooting and are also glad to have the guns "stay in the family".  Take this path first!

2.  Avoid pawn shops for firearm transactions.  Most of them have an inflated price for what they sell.  Additionally, most of them don't even know the history/condition of what they're selling.

3.  Many good deals can be found locally at either gun stores or through classifieds.  Think USED.  Good rifles or handguns can be had in the $200-350 range all day long.  They might not be "scary", but they'll protect you and put food on the table.
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Offline NWPilgrim

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #7 on: January 14, 2013, 02:51:32 AM »
+1 what Flippy said.  Used guns are a great value.  Popular brands and models not so much but something a little off-beat can be a LOT cheaper. It's been a while since I looked but an old Marlin 336 .30-30 was around $250.  Find a lever action that someone has butchered trying to mount a cheap scope on it or gashed up the wood or let the outside get lightly rust pitted. You want a nice clean bore, but for a general purpose, inexpensive rifle I would accept light out rust pitting for a big reduction in price. A .30-30 lever action is plenty of gun for hunting or defense to 150 yds at least. A .30-30 is often much cheaper than the .357 or .44 versions. In fact, I've about got myself talked into going out and getting exactly this just for fun!
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Offline flippydidit

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2013, 02:55:02 AM »
+1 what Flippy said.  Used guns are a great value.  Popular brands and models not so much but something a little off-beat can be a LOT cheaper. It's been a while since I looked but an old Marlin 336 .30-30 was around $250.  Find a lever action that someone has butchered trying to mount a cheap scope on it or gashed up the wood or let the outside get lightly rust pitted. You want a nice clean bore, but for a general purpose, inexpensive rifle I would accept light out rust pitting for a big reduction in price. A .30-30 lever action is plenty of gun for hunting or defense to 150 yds at least. A .30-30 is often much cheaper than the .357 or .44 versions. In fact, I've about got myself talked into going out and getting exactly this just for fun!

Need a nudge?  A gun in the safe is worth 100 at the store.  What's $250?  You spend more than that on car insurance and don't have anything to show for it.  Come on <insert peer pressure> a real man wouldn't need to think about it.

 ;D
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Offline NWPilgrim

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2013, 01:29:05 PM »
Need a nudge?  A gun in the safe is worth 100 at the store.  What's $250?  You spend more than that on car insurance and don't have anything to show for it.  Come on <insert peer pressure> a real man wouldn't need to think about it.

 ;D

Haha Nate, you are a real arm twister! I guess I'm a real manly man because I need no further convincing!!

I'm going to look for one of these at the end of the month when my bonus comes in.  I had been putting this off because I was thinking a nice new stainless Marlin in .44 but that is close to $600.  But a beater gun with nice bore for $250 that I wouldn't mind it getting more dinged up and dragged around would be ideal. I'll post back what I find. Hopefully the semiauto craze going on has not inflated the used lever action market as well. It was nice having all my ARs before the previous craze, and I was still able to get a CMP Garand for $650 while ARs were going for $1,500+.
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Offline windchill

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2013, 03:55:44 PM »
I would argue that a basic battery is not complete without a scoped hunting rifle in one of the common centerfire calibers such as 30-06, 270, 243, etc., that can put shots on targets that exceed the practical range of your AK. As mentioned, the Savage or Stevens bolt rifle is still a great buy and they shoot well out of the box.

I would like a few that would serve specifically as backup in case I no longer had access to mine. (Could be lost, stolen, confiscated) Something that could provide me some self defense and/or hunting.

For the reasons you listed I would suggest a concealable sidearm, a .22LR rifle, and a 12 ga. shotgun, in that order. Don't forget the ammo.

Offline robertov416

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #11 on: January 14, 2013, 06:09:06 PM »
Need a nudge?  A gun in the safe is worth 100 at the store.  What's $250?  You spend more than that on car insurance and don't have anything to show for it.  Come on <insert peer pressure> a real man wouldn't need to think about it.

 ;D

LOL.... you've done this before, haven't you. :D

Offline NWPilgrim

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #12 on: January 14, 2013, 06:28:18 PM »
Yikes, just read on another forum that even lever actions are being priced high now, some common ones as high as $1,000. I hope when I start look at at the end of the month there are still reasonable deals on used ones or I will have to pass until prices settle down again. Hopefully revolvers aren't going crazy two.  Maybe this is the year to get that Super Blackhawk.
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Offline endurance

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2013, 06:38:35 PM »
I'd look at inexpensive used guns via armslist.com and other local sources that are so simple they'll still do the job no matter what.  Single shot or double barrel shotguns, bolt action or single shot .22s, .22 revolvers and the like are guns you can put in the ground without having to worry about whether they come back to you or not.  They're also already in calibers you own, so if you lost the guns, you'd still have ammo for them.

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Offline Erigorn

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #14 on: January 15, 2013, 09:20:51 AM »
I would argue that a basic battery is not complete without a scoped hunting rifle in one of the common centerfire calibers such as 30-06, 270, 243, etc., that can put shots on targets that exceed the practical range of your AK. As mentioned, the Savage or Stevens bolt rifle is still a great buy and they shoot well out of the box.

For the reasons you listed I would suggest a concealable sidearm, a .22LR rifle, and a 12 ga. shotgun, in that order. Don't forget the ammo.

You make a good point about missing a long range rifle. You also mention the savage or Stevens. What models? I'll browse through the rifle threads but if you reply it would help. I'm fairly inexperienced in firearms. A couple of my 13 skills are too address that. I've never been hunting either so could really use some advice. If it helps I live in northern Utah so the is a combination of wide open desert and forested hills.

Offline endurance

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #15 on: January 15, 2013, 12:22:38 PM »
You make a good point about missing a long range rifle. You also mention the savage or Stevens. What models? I'll browse through the rifle threads but if you reply it would help. I'm fairly inexperienced in firearms. A couple of my 13 skills are too address that. I've never been hunting either so could really use some advice. If it helps I live in northern Utah so the is a combination of wide open desert and forested hills.
My first hunting rifle was a Savage 110E 30-06.  Nothing wrong with it, 1moa accuracy all day long.  Not as smooth of an action or trigger as you'll find with a high end Remington 700, but nowhere near as expensive and perfectly serviceable.  It's a little on the light side, which is great for carrying in the woods, but that also means it's a brute for recoil compared to a heavier gun.

Personally, I've moved away from 30-06, but not too far away.  I like the .270 because it's a little flatter shooting and I took up antelope hunting in the last few years and it has less recoil than the 30-06 because it's a lighter bullet.  It's still a common caliber, but if you want to have military rounds available the .308 might be a better choice.  That said, there's still a fair amount of 30-06 WWII and Korean War era 30-06 ammo around if you want something unique like a armor piercing or incendiary round.  IMHO, I'd stick to one of those three calibers.  I don't like the big magnum calibers and while I've enjoyed shooting .243  because of its exceptionally low recoil, I'm not sure I'd want it as my only hunting round in elk and moose country.
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Offline dswaim

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #16 on: January 15, 2013, 12:54:46 PM »
What about a good lever-action?  I love my 30-30 lever-action, and it will take down any big game here in East Texas.  The local Academy had the Mossberg Maverick 88 for around $190.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2013, 01:04:34 PM by dswaim »

Offline Canadian Prepper

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #17 on: January 15, 2013, 01:19:46 PM »
Any Savage or Stevens 110, 10 action models would be a great value in any of the main calibres.

A Stevens 200 might sell new for little over $300 and sometimes you can get new or used deals on them (such as the like new used Savage 10FP carbine with mounts that I found for $399 a few months back).

I think that you should follow flipydidit's advice of keeping your eyes out for "targets of opportunity" so to speak available from friends, relatives or even some surprising deals that show up at gun shops. For instance, last year I picked up a VG condition Remington 760 in .30.06 with Weaver 4x scope, tip off mounts, a spare magazine and 70 rounds of ammunition at an otherwise pricey gun shop for $226 all taxes in. Though I hadn't had my sights on that specific rifle, I couldn pass up such a nice gun for the price (it was also sighted in pretty much dead on, and more than accurate enough for any big game I'd hunt with it within standard ranges). Though I suspect that almost everything will be more expensive and harder to find in the short term, some deals might still be had on bolt, pump and standard semi (i.e. Rem 7400) while everyone stockpiles the more military looking rifles.

I'm a fan of the Mosin, especially if you could inspect the bores ahead of time, and many M44 carbines (admittedly harder to find) often come with pristine bores. I have no problems hitting the gong at 200 yards at my club with an older M91/30 with a somewhat worn but sericeable barrel.

If SKSs could still be found at reasonable prices, that could serve as a cheaper substitute for your AK that still fires the same ammo, but again that choice would largely be dependent upon availability.

Offline windchill

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #18 on: January 15, 2013, 02:31:25 PM »
What models?
Savage 110, Stevens 200

They are identical with the exception of fit and finish, barrel profile, and trigger selection. The Savage is offered in a larger variety of chamberings and barrel profiles, and most all now have the Accutrigger. The Stevens is priced cheaper because of the lack of features that don't really mean much to some people. I have a model 200 in .22-250 and a Savage 111 in 30-06 from before the Accutrigger. I worked both the triggers over to get something I liked. The Stevens stock needed the edges smoothed and a little material removed for barrel clearance. With a $300 rifle you can sand on it and rattlecan yourself a new paint job without feeling too bad about it. With good quality mounts and rings, and a good scope, these rifles will almost always out-shoot the shooter.

Offline Erigorn

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #19 on: January 16, 2013, 12:25:21 AM »
Savage 110, Stevens 200

They are identical with the exception of fit and finish, barrel profile, and trigger selection. The Savage is offered in a larger variety of chamberings and barrel profiles, and most all now have the Accutrigger. The Stevens is priced cheaper because of the lack of features that don't really mean much to some people. I have a model 200 in .22-250 and a Savage 111 in 30-06 from before the Accutrigger. I worked both the triggers over to get something I liked. The Stevens stock needed the edges smoothed and a little material removed for barrel clearance. With a $300 rifle you can sand on it and rattlecan yourself a new paint job without feeling too bad about it. With good quality mounts and rings, and a good scope, these rifles will almost always out-shoot the shooter.

Fantastic explaination. Thanks.

Offline Canadian Prepper

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #20 on: January 31, 2013, 01:40:14 PM »
Even with things as crazy as they are at the moment, I'm pretty sure that you could get an inexpensive used .22 (single shot or repeater bolt action) for under $100, perhaps even half that. If your other one is lost, temporarily inaccessable, etc, that spare .22 could fill an important niche harvesting small game, while the extra ammo won't take up much space at all.

If you keep your eyes open, older pump shotguns with a polychoke or comparable device can be had for under $150. Some might not be suitable for steel shot, but are otherwise far more versatile than most fixed choke guns.

You could add a Mosin and possibly still be under $350 total expenditure. As much as I like to recommend the Stevens 200 or similar Savage actions, I tend to view them as guns you'll like to use regularly and not have cached up, especially since you haven't a scoped centerfire rifle suitable for longer range hunting (I consider an AK as equivalent to a .30.30).

Offline Erigorn

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #21 on: February 01, 2013, 12:37:41 AM »
Thanks for the suggestion. Is it true....i am missing a long range scoped rifle. For a long time I though my AK was long range...but the more I learn the more I realize its more mid range. Looks like this thread has pointed out that my arsenal is a gun short. With that in mind I need to pick up a 5th gun. Then on to weapons to cache.
 

Offline 4bull

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Re: good budget backup gun suggestions?
« Reply #22 on: February 01, 2013, 12:48:53 AM »
I try to bring home as many new friends as i can . Funeral on monday and a old 8MM fallowed me home and 15 rounds. I try to pick up all the .22's i can , i traded off ammo i didnt have a use for , for ammo i did. we were all happy happy happy.