Author Topic: Is It Fair That a Florida Mom Received a 20-Year Sentence for Firing ‘Warning Sh  (Read 5433 times)

Offline dep190

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In light of recent high profile self defense shootings you may want to consider having an insurance policy http://www.armedcitizensnetwork.org/home    a NRA or gun owners memberships or a small bag of money stashed at home in the event heaven forbid you have to use your weapon or are prosecuted for such actions! Florida seems to have some messed up laws!

  Is It Fair That a Florida Mom Received a 20-Year Sentence for Firing ‘Warning Shot’?




 http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/07/15/is-it-fair-that-a-florida-mom-received-a-20-year-sentence-for-firing-warning-shot/

Offline Cedar

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Especially since the husband said the event took place one way and then took place another. He looks suspicious in that. She never wavered in her story from the articles I read. A bullet never connected with him and if it was in the house, where is the bullet? (Singular bullet, since she only fired once he said). How does 'Stand your Ground" law not work here for her when he had already been abusive in the past? When he had just trapped her in the bathroom? Since the kids were present, what did they say about the incident? If anyone needs to protested for in a gun incident, I think perhaps she needs it more than TM/GZ. If she was going to get 20 years in hindsight anyway, she might have been better off shooting him. She might have been out faster.

Cedar

Offline RitaRose1945

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i know people are thinking this is an obvious scenario, but it's really not.  I'm just starting to hear about this, and at first I was thinking how it was a (unintended pun) black and white situation.  Now it doesn't really appear to be.

From the story:
Quote
Alexander was also charged with domestic battery four months after the shooting in another assault on Gray, which many said indicated little remorse over the first incident. She pleaded no contest and was sentenced to time served.

Her family says that doesn’t erase the fact that a relatively law-abiding person — a woman with a master’s degree — who was making positive contributions to society will endure prison for two decades over a single violation in which no one was hurt.

She pleaded no contest to assaulting the guy that she was convicted of shooting.  So... it's not like she's completely incapable of violence.

And stating that she has a Masters degree - seriously?  Like that automatically makes someone a peaceful, law abiding citizen???

At the same time, this part is all wrong:

Quote
A judge threw out Alexander’s “stand your ground” self-defense claim, noting that she could have run out of the house to escape her husband but instead got the gun and went back inside.  Alexander claimed she did try to escape through the garage, but after finding the garage door was jammed, grabbed her gun before going back.

Either you have "stand your ground" or you don't.  If he was aggressive, then she was not obligated to "run out of the house and escape her husband".  And if the garage door really was jammed, then she had no place to go anyway.  But if the garage door was jammed, how did she get her car in there?  What are the odds it would suddenly jam at this one particular time?

Offline BlueHound

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We don't know all the facts, but I'm sure that she really hurt her case when she left the house, went back to her car to retrieve the gun, and then returned to the house.  Returning makes it difficult to say that she was in fear for her life and that firing the gun was self defense.

Offline Cedar

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Either you have "stand your ground" or you don't. 

Yep.

If he was aggressive, then she was not obligated to "run out of the house and escape her husband". 

And often, you cannot run far enough from them anyway. Even for years.

But if the garage door was jammed, how did she get her car in there?  What are the odds it would suddenly jam at this one particular time?

This happened to my mom all the time on her side of the garage. I forgot what the deal is, but she had to have the repairman out every few weeks for about a year. The garage door would only open about 2" and start blinking and 'crunching' back and forth that 2 to 2 1/2" back and forth. And that made me think again I do not want to have an electric door opener ever (what if your electric goes out? and those doors are heavy).

Cedar

Offline Cedar

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Returning makes it difficult to say that she was in fear for her life and that firing the gun was self defense.

Is this a fact now? Because earlier the husband said 2 different stories. One she never left and the second that she left.

Cedar

Offline BlueHound

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Is this a fact now? Because earlier the husband said 2 different stories. One she never left and the second that she left.

Cedar

We'll never know.  We don't know what she told the police.  And the media could have all the fact wrong.  I've been on crime scenes and knew the intricate details of what happened, but then read the story in the newspaper and all of the facts were wrong.  It seems that they just make up the story sometimes.  In this case I wouldn't rush to judgement based on what that article said, but if she really did go back to her car and return with a gun, I would not call that self defense or standing your ground.

Offline The Professor

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Well, a couple of things, here.

First, to answer the question asked by the original poster:

Is it fair?

If you allow the law to stand, then yes, it's fair.  The question should be, initially, about the law.

Wielding a firearm gets you 10 years?  Really?  Oh well, obviously that's what the people in Florida want because that's the law, right?

Firing a gun is 20 years?  Same answer. 

Rather than regurgitate all the "facts" about this particular incident, the simple matter is that she was found guilty by her peers.  Those same peers were restrained by the laws set forth by the State of Florida in both how to find her guilty and how to sentence her.

If you don't like the rules. . .CHANGE THEM. If you can't change them, move.

Personally, I think these sentencing mandates are ridiculous.  And yes, I put my money where my mouth is.  I live in Colorado, currently.  If we don't have a change of administration which is more gun friendly in the next Gubernatorial election cycle, we're gone.

Sadly, though, in my state there are more "pro-gun" organizations that seem to just want to use the situation to raise even more money for their personal retirement funds rather than overturn the laws or recall the elected officials who allowed this to pass.

The Professor

Offline archer

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And I just got this on my CNN News feed:
Attorney General Eric Holder called for doing away with "stand your ground" self-defense laws, telling the NAACP the statutes "sow dangerous conflict in our neighborhoods" and allow "violent situations to escalate in public."

Offline RitaRose1945

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And that's why I get so ticked off.

If this really were an issue and bands of roaming vigilantes were grabbing people off the street and dragging them into their homes to shoot them, I'd almost see it.

But NONE of these cases have ANYTHING to do with the laws they suddenly feed the need to push through.

They're just excuses so the average guy who doesn't know thinks "Well, I'm glad they're doing something to prevent this from happening again!"

Offline The Professor

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They're just excuses so the average guy who doesn't know thinks "Well, I'm glad they're doing something to prevent this from happening again!"


And, partly, what's happening now is that I, as a CCW holder and a person who goes where-ever he wishes, now have an extra level of doubt thrown into the force continuum decisions.

The laws are supposed to protect the law-abider.  But that's simply not the case, anymore.

The Professor

d3nni5

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Here is another perspective on the "warning shot"....

A 57 year old grandmother, fires some shots in the general direction of sounds she thought were intruders on her property with the intent of scaring them off.   One shot went through her son's neighboring house, killing her 11 year old grandson while he was in bed asleep.

Surprisingly, no charges yet!  And if you read all the stories below, you get the impression that this was not the first time this woman had done this.   The local prosecutor is leaving it up to the next grand jury to decide what (if any) charges will be brought against her.


http://wvmetronews.com/harrson-county-boy-dead-in-accidental-shooting/
http://wvmetronews.com/harrison-prosecutor-to-take-shooting-death-to-grand-jury/
http://wvmetronews.com/harrison-prosecutor-says-jarvisville-case-should-start-discussion/

Offline ncjeeper

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Here is another perspective on the "warning shot"....

A 57 year old grandmother, fires some shots in the general direction of sounds she thought were intruders on her property with the intent of scaring them off. 
She just did what Joe Biden said to do. :o

Offline cdhm22

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I think the thing to keep in mind is that no matter if the shot is intended as a "warning shot" or you meant to hit center mass, the law defines it as a use of deadly force. If you aren't willing to use the gun don't bring it out. If you aren't willing to kill someone, don't pull the trigger.

We are arm chair quarter backing this, but it is good to see scenarios like this so you can at least have thought of the repercussions if you do encounter a scenario even remotely close to this one.

Offline rotrhed

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Just a few thoughts on this..

1. I hate the fact that the husband - who admits to his own dirtbag-y-ness - got off with nothing.
2. I am really NOT comfortable with the minimum sentencing stuff...  Personally, I don't see it as a deterrent at all.  Florida has a minimum 20 year sentence, for the use of a firearm in the commission of a felony.. which is what she got whacked with.
3. I vaguely recall that she had a restraining order on him - yet, the shooting incident took place in the house where HE lived, and she did not.
4. She did indeed go to her car (which, I believe, was parked in the garage, with the garage door closed) and acquire a firearm, and then returned to the scene...  that's a big no-no.
5. Firing a warning shot? Despite what Hollywood seems to want us all to believe, warning shots, aren't.  You do not fire your weapon unless you are threatened, and if you are threatened, you fire at the assailant - not the wall, not the ceiling, not the ground...

The case sounds like a classic situation of Dumb & Dumber.  If she wanted something, she should have asked him to ship it to her.  If he refused? Guess she'd be outta luck.  No 'stuff' is worth dying for ( purportedly, the guy was VERY physically aggressive, both with her, and former partners of his).

Sad.

Offline Crazy Fox

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If you aren't willing to use the gun don't bring it out. If you aren't willing to kill someone, don't pull the trigger.

Absolutely right. DO NOT FIRE WARNING SHOTS, people! It seems like I usually hear this "warning shot" nonsense from new shooters, overconsiderate women, and macho mall ninjas but it's something that even experienced, level-headed shooters need to remember.

Firing "warning shots" almost never works out well for the shooter. All it does is put others at risk (remember your firearms safety rules). This guy got lucky, he could have ended up serving time or killing somebody:

http://www.abqjournal.com/109603/news/no-charges-in-santa-fe-ricochet-shooting.html

d3nni5

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Re: Is It Fair That a Florida Mom Received a 20-Year Sentence for Firing ‘
« Reply #16 on: December 13, 2013, 01:50:18 PM »
Here is another perspective on the "warning shot"....

A 57 year old grandmother, fires some shots in the general direction of sounds she thought were intruders on her property with the intent of scaring them off.   One shot went through her son's neighboring house, killing her 11 year old grandson while he was in bed asleep.

Surprisingly, no charges yet!  And if you read all the stories below, you get the impression that this was not the first time this woman had done this.   The local prosecutor is leaving it up to the next grand jury to decide what (if any) charges will be brought against her.


http://wvmetronews.com/harrson-county-boy-dead-in-accidental-shooting/
http://wvmetronews.com/harrison-prosecutor-to-take-shooting-death-to-grand-jury/
http://wvmetronews.com/harrison-prosecutor-says-jarvisville-case-should-start-discussion/

Just a follow up on this thread.   She will get one year probation after pleading guilty to involuntary manslaughter.

http://wvmetronews.com/2013/12/12/grandmother-sentenced-to-1-year-probation-after-grandsons-death/