Author Topic: Is Long Term Storage Changing?  (Read 784 times)

Online David in MN

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Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« on: September 04, 2017, 07:00:44 AM »
Don't hate. Up front I'll admit I have a serious supply of long term. I think we could go 6 months after the pantry emptied. But...

I shop at Costco. A lot. Weekly. Since I have a child who drinks milk like I drank beer in college it makes sense. So I've priced out everything there. I cook every night and I like things like homemade bread, stir fry, Cajun, etc. So heavy use items like rice, flour, canned beans, and the like have switched to annual purchases rather than weekly grocery pickups. Yes it is odd to buy 35 lbs of rice at a time but I break even quick.

This has revolutionized my pantry. Midway between purchases and I have maybe 20 lbs. of rice and 35 lbs. of flour. That sounds like a healthy long term starting point. But it's my pantry. Years ago these would be in my crawlspace.

We talk a lot about how much and what and where. But after one Costco run a neighbor with pounds of rice, beans, flour, dried fruit, cases of broth, and so on looks like she's doing a heck of a lot better than I did with prepping in mind a decade ago. I'm starting to look at an annual Costco run as my mid/long term storage. And it saves me money in the here and now.

I'm curious if others are finding this pattern. Between club stores and online bulk shopping has changed. Has it impacted your storage?
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Offline Smurf Hunter

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #1 on: September 04, 2017, 07:59:51 AM »
For me, there's a short list of ingredients that we eat routinely, are inexpensive and store well.  If we baked more, I can totally see bulk flour purchases.
I guess we've been sort of doing this with rice and a few staple canned goods.

It's a comparatively expensive, but I prefer some of the premium rice like Jasmin or even Basmati.  In fact I mylarred up (my new verb) about 100lbs the other day into 1 gallon bags, which weighs around 7lbs.
I think I figured that out to be 16 cups per bag.  If I'm making a rice based dish like arroz con pollo, paella or similar, 1 cup seems a standard amount. Point being with dry goods, you can repackage into increments that fit your family's needs.

I should start buying broth by the case.  We always use it.

A good mental exercise I should do more is planning to have NO fresh ingredients.  If we're down to dry goods stored in the pantry, what can I prepare that's appetizing?
During peace time I'm not going to hydrate freeze dried broccoli, I'll buy it fresh. But I wonder if a moderate amount of such things would be a good compliment to rice and other grain stores?

Offline Carl

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #2 on: September 04, 2017, 08:34:26 AM »
  Variety and spice make for a much better menu. I use almost exclusively LTS foods as the shared BOL is to a point that food rotation provides a large quantity of my food and also food I often donate to neighbors in need. My dog sometimes complains about pork chops or chicken on the third day in a row,but she is good natured and accepts the hardship. My food has changed due to circumstance as my mobility is so poor and I get few volunteers to grocery shop for me.
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Offline mountainmoma

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #3 on: September 04, 2017, 09:03:04 AM »
Welcome to family food budgeting !

This is where I started out, bulk purchases by the case and bag as I had 2, and then 3, children. With friends. It is the deep pantry. It is less expensive to buy rice and beans by the 25lb bag, potatoes in late November by the 50lb bag, a case of favorite cereal, flour, wheatberries, sugar etc....   It is not only less expensive but convenient to have what we need on hand without the inconvenience and time spend time at the store buying staple foods.

I have always had 3-6 months food in the pantry. I keep flour, sugar, rice, rolled oats, wheat berries there in unlined 5 gallon pails with gamma seal lids. I have a 2 gallon bucket with gamma lid for powdered sugar/brown sugar. I keep the chocolate chips in a couple half gallon jars. I buy canned goods by the case, or at this point, can my own. I dehydrate a bit of parsley, green onions, celery and put in glass quart jars. Dried apples and persimmons in glass 1/2 gallon jars. Dont forget butter in the freezer, when the kids were here, I would have up to 12 lbs of butter in the freezer. I have a very small amount of Peak full fat dried milk or milkman depending, in the pantry. This is rotated out to make hot coco or chai mix annually. Cocoa powder and raisons by the 5 lb box, put into tupperware.

When I started to think of longer term prepping just not that many years ago is when I then added a separate LTS, and that has another 12 months of food. And, at this point, as I am back to cooking for one, the pantry needs to change, so I had to go out and mylar up in one gallons' excess beans, so then I can open one at a time to keep the beans fresher. The beans were only in very large tupperware is why.

After experimenting with cooking with storage food a few years ago, I also have a quart jar of tomato powder as this can be easier to thicken than using a partial can of tomato paste. SO, I usually only have home canned diced tomatoes, and then dehydrated powder. I also now have 2 #10 cans in the pantry, for a shorter term "earthquake" or other short term disruption where I cant get fresh, soup mix veggies and carrots.

I have in general since finding out about it 25+ years ago ordered from a monthly food co-op and not just gone to Costco. Although, Costco now does have more organic and natural foods than 25 years ago ! recently, I order thru Azure Standard, https://www.azurestandard.com/my-account/drops/find . They have drop points all over west of the Mississippi.
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Offline mountainmoma

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #4 on: September 04, 2017, 09:14:36 AM »
Quote
A good mental exercise I should do more is planning to have NO fresh ingredients.  If we're down to dry goods stored in the pantry, what can I prepare that's appetizing?
During peace time I'm not going to hydrate freeze dried broccoli, I'll buy it fresh. But I wonder if a moderate amount of such things would be a good compliment to rice and other grain stores?

I recommend this. LDS food storage has #10 cans of dried carrots and onions, and getting a can of each to be in the pantry would make all the food better. One can would last a very long time. I opened a can of each and put in my pantry winter before last and cooked with it extensively it both are very good, the carrots are firm and fresh once soaked, the onions smell and texture as fresh onions ( albeit wet fresh onions...) If you do not have alot of canned tomatoes, a can of dehydrated tomato powder is fantastic, if you rotate cases of canned tomato products, you may not need this. A can of LDS Potato flakes might be helpful, or a can of potato dices or soup veggies from another source ( soup veggies had diced potato, cabbage, onion, etc...I forget....) Corn adds good texture to chili.

You can also buy small quantities of dried veggies, one pounds or less, corn, dried peppers, tomato powder, onions, garlic, I know Azure Standard Co-op has these, and maybe a local health food store.
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Offline Smurf Hunter

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #5 on: September 04, 2017, 09:38:29 AM »
I recommend this. LDS food storage has #10 cans of dried carrots and onions, and getting a can of each to be in the pantry would make all the food better. One can would last a very long time. I opened a can of each and put in my pantry winter before last and cooked with it extensively it both are very good, the carrots are firm and fresh once soaked, the onions smell and texture as fresh onions ( albeit wet fresh onions...) If you do not have alot of canned tomatoes, a can of dehydrated tomato powder is fantastic, if you rotate cases of canned tomato products, you may not need this. A can of LDS Potato flakes might be helpful, or a can of potato dices or soup veggies from another source ( soup veggies had diced potato, cabbage, onion, etc...I forget....) Corn adds good texture to chili.

You can also buy small quantities of dried veggies, one pounds or less, corn, dried peppers, tomato powder, onions, garlic, I know Azure Standard Co-op has these, and maybe a local health food store.

I cook with a lot of onions.  If I could dial in a source of LTS onions that stored, cooked and ate well, I'd be pleased.

Are those #10 LDS cans dehydrated or freeze dried?

Online David in MN

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #6 on: September 04, 2017, 09:59:21 AM »
I guess the fresh question is relevant. I don't think of it this time of year because I could go weeks with a bag of rice, a bag of flour, and my garden. I tend to store things like canned mushrooms and chilis in adobo for "fresh" flavor to add to dishes when in need. I always keep onions, celery, and carrots like any proper chef.

Totally agree with the potatoes. And I'll add on the 12 or 15 packs of canned tuna I get. And multipacks of sardines (my favorite snack). I now buy charcoal in 30 lb quantity.

Before the baby I went to Costco once a month for fruit, meat, olive oil, and coffee. We didn't drink milk. Since I'm swinging by weekly for milk, I've really picked up other stuff. It's actually changed my view of stored food. I know if I have over a year's worth of rice and flour for normal usage (and I bake a lot) I'm pretty well stocked. Buying potatoes 15 lbs at a time seems like a prep move as well.

It's funny. The older I get the less prepping looks like MREs and an AR-15 and the more it looks like my grandparent's farm.
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Offline Smurf Hunter

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #7 on: September 04, 2017, 10:11:59 AM »
I guess the fresh question is relevant. I don't think of it this time of year because I could go weeks with a bag of rice, a bag of flour, and my garden. I tend to store things like canned mushrooms and chilis in adobo for "fresh" flavor to add to dishes when in need. I always keep onions, celery, and carrots like any proper chef.

Totally agree with the potatoes. And I'll add on the 12 or 15 packs of canned tuna I get. And multipacks of sardines (my favorite snack). I now buy charcoal in 30 lb quantity.

Before the baby I went to Costco once a month for fruit, meat, olive oil, and coffee. We didn't drink milk. Since I'm swinging by weekly for milk, I've really picked up other stuff. It's actually changed my view of stored food. I know if I have over a year's worth of rice and flour for normal usage (and I bake a lot) I'm pretty well stocked. Buying potatoes 15 lbs at a time seems like a prep move as well.

It's funny. The older I get the less prepping looks like MREs and an AR-15 and the more it looks like my grandparent's farm.

I've seriously slacked on the vegetable garden this year, but I know from experience growing the root veggies is pretty simple.  However even from locally grown sources, carrots, celery, onions and potatoes are incredibly cheap.  It's almost not worth growing my own aside from the hobby aspect.

Offline mountainmoma

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #8 on: September 04, 2017, 10:12:50 AM »
I cook with a lot of onions.  If I could dial in a source of LTS onions that stored, cooked and ate well, I'd be pleased.

Are those #10 LDS cans dehydrated or freeze dried?

They are dehydrated. You do not need to freeze dry onions, they dry and reconstitute well. A large #10 can lasts a long time. The onions rehydrate realy well, smell like onions, firm, etc....

I bought mine from the LDS ( mormon) storehouse. There must be one of those somewheres near your area. Price is low there. One can will get you months using every day. Cant imaginehaving to cook LTS legumes with them. Every other LTS company also sells these, But LDS storehouse has the best prices, you can pick up a can of carrots while you are there.....

Carrots also do not need to be freeze dried, they also dry and reconstitute well. Same for potatoes.
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Offline mountainmoma

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2017, 10:51:22 AM »
Growing a small amount is good to keep skill level up, as there is a learning curve. Potatoes and onions are low care to grow. I actually have a very hard time trying to grow lettuce and carrots, so something I need to practice. Timing is hard where I live.

I forgot, about the dehydrated onions, they are diced smaller than I would be able to do by hand. Otherwise, no difference.
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Offline mountainmoma

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #10 on: September 04, 2017, 12:11:10 PM »
If you want to try small amounts, the Long Term Storage packaged products are basically these ( the tomato is similar to what I have gotten in #10 cans, although the minced onions thru Azure are small, smaller than the #10 can I tried, I have not tried Azures dried carrots, likely similar), so you can have a small amount in pantry or try :

Onions https://www.azurestandard.com/shop/product/food/spices-seasonings/herbs/onion/minced/onion-minced-organic/9554

tomato powder https://www.azurestandard.com/shop/product/food/dehydrated-foods/vegetables/tomatoes/dried/tomato-powder-dehydrated/11327

carrots https://www.azurestandard.com/shop/product/food/dehydrated-foods/vegetables/carrots/dried/carrot-puffed-diced-dehydrated/7006

bell pepper https://www.azurestandard.com/shop/product/food/dehydrated-foods/vegetables/peppers/dried/bell-peppers-red-diced-dehydrated/6580

The latest LDS home storage price list is here, https://providentliving.lds.org/bc/providentliving/content/content/english/self-reliance/food-storage/home-storage-center-order-form/pdf/HomeStorageCenterOrderForm-US-short.pdf?lang=eng

Onions, #10 can, 2.4lbs is only $9      I like this diced size fine, the minced thru azure were small
Carrots, #10 can, 2.8lb, is only $11.50

LDS home storage only sells potato flakes, you can get potato dices or potato shreds and tomato powder thru all the other usual preparedness food places.

When I set up the Long Term Emergency foods at our local fire station/evac center, I made sure to include some of these. Sample menus can be made like this :

Split pea soup, rice ( uses dried onions and carrots)
lentil soup ( uses tomato powder, dried onions, dried carrots and to be served like sheppards pie with mashed potatoes made with potato flakes)
chili with rice or polenta ( uses tomato powder, dried onions -- put some dried carrots, onion and a bit of tomato powder to make the rice spanish rice)
baked beans over rice ( uses dried onions) if you have nothing else, you can make a thin starter soup with tomato and onion carrot pieces to serve with it

etc...
« Last Edit: September 04, 2017, 12:21:47 PM by mountainmoma »
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Offline Carl

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #11 on: September 04, 2017, 12:22:46 PM »
I cook with a lot of onions.  If I could dial in a source of LTS onions that stored, cooked and ate well, I'd be pleased.

Are those #10 LDS cans dehydrated or freeze dried?

Dehydrated and reconstitute pretty well as I have used them...good for 25 years in sealed can and 6 months were OK in capped but open can

https://www.amazon.com/Augason-Farms-Dehydrated-Chopped-Onions/dp/B0096GQ1C0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1504549093&sr=8-1&keywords=%2310+can+onions
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Offline mountainmoma

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #12 on: September 04, 2017, 12:30:08 PM »
Dehydrated and reconstitute pretty well as I have used them...good for 25 years in sealed can and 6 months were OK in capped but open can

https://www.amazon.com/Augason-Farms-Dehydrated-Chopped-Onions/dp/B0096GQ1C0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1504549093&sr=8-1&keywords=%2310+can+onions

exactly the experience I have had with the #10 LDS cans, pictures look like the same product, so if you cant get out, these can be sent to you. But, the LDS cans cost less than 1/2 as much, if you have one of their stores conveniently close to you.

Like Carl, I have used an open can with its plastic lid over 6 months of cooking, same with the carrots. although, it is likely better if you subdivide the can once opened and put some in a quart jar to use once you have used up the rest of the can. Depends on your humidity and how fast you go thru it.
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Offline chad

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #13 on: September 04, 2017, 01:00:18 PM »
Just checked honeyville, they have a lot of stuff in #10 cans also. Mix or match 6 cans and get 10% off.

Offline Carl

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #14 on: September 04, 2017, 03:07:31 PM »
  I see LTS becoming more commonplace and more places selling number 10 cans of food at resonable prices . I would not choose the LTS food for economy though I get much of mine for the time it takes to rotate it out and my BOL has some members that have goods that are 15 years old and happily purchase 'NEW' stuff and tell me to do 'whatever I want' with the old stock and I really must admit that the newer LTS foods do have better taste and texture than the old stock so the process too has improved.
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Online David in MN

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #15 on: September 13, 2017, 11:11:30 AM »
I should add from a cost savings perspective if any of you are gin drinkers (like me) you should definitely try the Kirkland brand gin. It's actually really good and at ~$19 for a 1.75 it's a screaming bargain. Their white tequila is supposed to be good as well but I'm not much of a tequila man.
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Offline Smurf Hunter

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #16 on: September 13, 2017, 11:58:43 AM »
I should add from a cost savings perspective if any of you are gin drinkers (like me) you should definitely try the Kirkland brand gin. It's actually really good and at ~$19 for a 1.75 it's a screaming bargain. Their white tequila is supposed to be good as well but I'm not much of a tequila man.

Except in Costco's home state of WA - part of the political horse trading to get private (non state store) liquor sales was a MASSIVE tax.
That $20 1.75L bottle gets a 20% tax rate, + $6 flat tax for the 1.75L size bottle (a fifth is $4, 350ml $2, etc.).

When I road trip out of state, it's worth my time to stock up, as I can save $10 a bottle depending on the local tax rates :(


Online David in MN

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #17 on: September 13, 2017, 12:02:53 PM »
Except in Costco's home state of WA - part of the political horse trading to get private (non state store) liquor sales was a MASSIVE tax.
That $20 1.75L bottle gets a 20% tax rate, + $6 flat tax for the 1.75L size bottle (a fifth is $4, 350ml $2, etc.).

When I road trip out of state, it's worth my time to stock up, as I can save $10 a bottle depending on the local tax rates :(

Yikes. I'd be tempted to take up moonshining... I think I pay 12% tax and I guess I should be happy.
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Offline Smurf Hunter

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #18 on: September 13, 2017, 12:09:27 PM »
Yikes. I'd be tempted to take up moonshining... I think I pay 12% tax and I guess I should be happy.

I've done a lot of beer brewing and read up on shining.  I might some day, but have plenty of hobbies to consume my time for now.

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #19 on: September 13, 2017, 12:22:45 PM »
I've done a lot of beer brewing and read up on shining.  I might some day, but have plenty of hobbies to consume my time for now.
ha! same here.... too many hobbies...


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Offline Stwood

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #20 on: September 13, 2017, 12:26:17 PM »
Posted elsewhere, Augason Farms hard red wheat went up to $36.99 a bucket.
Their hard white wheat, is now the same price, up from $15.--
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Online David in MN

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2017, 12:29:20 PM »
I haven't made beer since the baby started walking.  :( But I still do meads and ciders since they aren't boiled. 5 gallons of Costco apple juice and 2 lbs of turbinado sugar make a great everyday cider.

I went to a homebrew shop in Germany a few years back and they had an all-glass home distilling kit. I guess the Europeans don't ban homemade spirits. It was something like 400 Euro and I was tempted but I doubted it would make the trip intact. And despite my freewheelin attitude my wife is pretty by the book.
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Offline Morning Sunshine

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #22 on: September 13, 2017, 12:52:34 PM »
Posted elsewhere, Augason Farms hard red wheat went up to $36.99 a bucket.
Their hard white wheat, is now the same price, up from $15.--

I read somewhere that a very late freeze/snowstorm decimated the wheat fields in Kansas this year.  If you can wait to stock up, try next fall; it might go down if the harvest is better.
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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #23 on: September 13, 2017, 02:26:11 PM »
.
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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #24 on: September 13, 2017, 02:31:00 PM »
Don't hate. Up front I'll admit I have a serious supply of long term. I think we could go 6 months after the pantry emptied. But...

I shop at Costco. A lot. Weekly. Since I have a child who drinks milk like I drank beer in college it makes sense. So I've priced out everything there. I cook every night and I like things like homemade bread, stir fry, Cajun, etc. So heavy use items like rice, flour, canned beans, and the like have switched to annual purchases rather than weekly grocery pickups. Yes it is odd to buy 35 lbs of rice at a time but I break even quick.

This has revolutionized my pantry. Midway between purchases and I have maybe 20 lbs. of rice and 35 lbs. of flour. That sounds like a healthy long term starting point. But it's my pantry. Years ago these would be in my crawlspace.

We talk a lot about how much and what and where. But after one Costco run a neighbor with pounds of rice, beans, flour, dried fruit, cases of broth, and so on looks like she's doing a heck of a lot better than I did with prepping in mind a decade ago. I'm starting to look at an annual Costco run as my mid/long term storage. And it saves me money in the here and now.

I'm curious if others are finding this pattern. Between club stores and online bulk shopping has changed. Has it impacted your storage?

I belong to Costco. I belong to Gleaners. I can. I freeze. I dehydrate..so I do a huge combination of manh things...

When I doubt, do what I did one year, and then you will know.
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Cedarj
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Offline Stwood

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Re: Is Long Term Storage Changing?
« Reply #25 on: September 13, 2017, 03:21:20 PM »
I read somewhere that a very late freeze/snowstorm decimated the wheat fields in Kansas this year.  If you can wait to stock up, try next fall; it might go down if the harvest is better.

Yes. Western Kansas, the largest producer of Hard Red wheat, lost (estimated) 20% of it's crop in a late ice/snow storm.

I'm stocked on wheat, but was thinking of getting more buckets of white...just because..but I waited too late.
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