Author Topic: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area  (Read 1862 times)

Offline David in MN

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Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« on: November 04, 2018, 04:52:27 PM »
OK, here goes. Two houses down there is a problem. Between 3-5 adults live there and 2 children are there also. 1 teen girl and 1 9-12 year old boy. Two days ago the woman I presumed to be the spouse and mom (I guess I never asked when we greeted them to the neighborhood) was dragged into an ambulance by police and restrained. I don't know the details. Since then the young man who spends nights there has disappeared. The dad? He's still there and doing car work in the drive. As I write a young man is there tinting his front windows because the sun in November in Minnesota is so unbearable. The teen's boyfried comes and goes at odd hours.

I live two doors down from at best a flop house and at worst a meth lab. The neighbors on the other side have their house for sale. I need to talk to them but it's really come to a head in the past two days and I need the time. I'm not the type to call the police and even if I did what would I say? They already picked up one resident. You don't have to be Sherlock to figure out like attracts like.

I know what trouble looks like. Without boring with my history suffice to say I know what I'm looking at.

What do I do? What protocol do we enact? Bear in mind this guy drives a tow truck. I'm legit scared that their friends are a safety risk. You remember when your good friend came to your house, left the truck running while he went inside, and let his young daughters turn up the music and dance in the street, right? (Today)

Right now I'm  :facepalm: What do I do? Mandate shotgun carrying around the household? Trailcam the yard? We already upped the wattage of our outdoor lights. Any ideas. It's a g-d nightmare.

Offline Mr. Bill

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2018, 08:36:53 PM »
Ugh.

I don't have much to suggest.  Maintain low profile, don't interact with them, gather information.  But that's all sorta obvious.  I agree with talking to the neighbors, especially the ones who are selling their house.

Maybe call the police and ask for info?  We did that once here when we saw a sheriff's deputy checking out a nearby garage, and he was happy to return our call.  I think they like it when people take an interest in what's happening in their neighborhood.  But I don't know what your local cops are like.

Good luck.

Offline Morning Sunshine

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2018, 08:40:41 PM »
sorry.  I got nothing.  Maybe be the really obnoxious neighbor that calls the cops on every infraction until they decide it is not worth the hassle and leave?

Offline David in MN

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #3 on: November 05, 2018, 06:52:56 AM »
Yeah, I don't know either. If there was evidence of a real crime I would call the police but absent that it's just BS code stuff I'm probably guilty of too.

I think tomorrow when my daughter is at school I can walk over and try to converse with the moving couple. I don't know them well, we're at different life stages. They are retired so it might be a coincidence but you don't often see a house go for sale and the next door neighbor get hauled off by the police.

I'm also trying to wrap my head around the current resident. If my wife was dragged kicking and screaming by the police I'm not sure how I'd react but it would be on the spectrum of total shut-in to apologizing to the neighbors for witnessing it. It would not be to do more work in the drive with the radio blaring. But I guess to a criminal we're just in the "I've been found so it's full tilt boogie" mode. I could understand a story about how she's been battling some demons and it came to a head and we'd appreciate prayers. I'd drop off cookies. I'd do what I could to help. I don't think the criminal justice system is the place for the mentally ill or addicts.

I'm also questioning everything. When we met they acted like a couple. Things were good over the summer. I gave them tomatoes. I let their kid pick fruit in my yard. Now I'm not sure whose kid he is. I had the inkling of drugs but I did what I always do and quietly looked away. Maybe they aren't even together at all and she was just a squat at his flop. Maybe she was just his strawberry (don't look that up if you don't understand suffice to say you have drugs and she's a lady). But she works for a cleaning service and walked the dog daily to meet her (I assume) son at the bus at the end of the block.

Something is escalating. These are not the actions of a rational person. We're in lockdown. Nothing open, all doors locked, all outdoor lights on 24/7. And we're not alone. Talked with a couple neighbors and they're on the same plan. If there is some solace it's that the eye of Sauron is on them. We all know where the danger is.

For the first time I'm looking forward to winter. A foot of snow is a damn good stupid filter.

Offline Stwood

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #4 on: November 05, 2018, 09:18:06 AM »
I would visit with the couple thats moving out.
Trail cam the yard.
Keep things locked up and stay out of the way.


Offline Sailor

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #5 on: November 05, 2018, 09:40:55 AM »
Are they homeowners?  You can get their names then.  Or use social media to get a name.  Search your states public records for criminal cases of that name.  That will give you all kinds of info.  Get some of the $25 Wyze cams off amazon, I have been using them even outside, with a 3d printed case I made to help keep out the water.  The picture is fantastic and the alerts you get on your phone are almost instant.  A large dog is always good. 

Offline Zef_66

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #6 on: November 05, 2018, 10:46:40 AM »
I would have no problem calling the police. Tell them you understand they cannot comment if it's an ongoing situation. But you saw the episode, and have seen other weird stuff going on. And wondered if there was anything else you should be looking out for. They might give you some things to watch for and call if you see. Cops are not dumb and want the bad guys off the streets as much as you do. They probably know what's going on and just need better info to jump on it.

Offline scoop

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #7 on: November 05, 2018, 11:30:56 AM »
You mentioned in another post about talking to the landlord.
Great idea, their activities might get them evicted.

Offline David in MN

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #8 on: November 06, 2018, 12:21:20 PM »
I talked to the nice old couple 4 doors down. They said, and I believe that they've been planning a move for some time. He's having trouble keeping up with the yard and she's having trouble with the stairs. Living next to the problem house doesn't help but they were on their way out anyway. We had a pleasant chat and I'm glad it wasn't a personal issue.

I walked home and then it happened. She drove right past me. Waved like nothing had happened. I'm gobsmacked. On Friday it took 3 police officers to literally fight her into an ambulance and come Tuesday it's back to normal. Like a weekend in jail is just her version of a spiritual retreat. I don't know what it takes to get officers to force you into an ambulance from your house but that feels like it comes with a little more than 3 days in the pokey. I don't know and I really don't care.

There could be a benign explanation. Maybe she got pain meds for an injury and suffered a bad response. But if that were the case wouldn't you run to your neighbors explaining it?

We talked last night and the Mrs. kind of thinks it's best to be quiet and mind our own business. Keep the doors locked and lights on. It's cold now anyway so there's no reason to have an open door.

Strange things to deal with.

Online FreeLancer

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #9 on: November 06, 2018, 02:02:46 PM »
Might have been an involuntary psychiatric hospitalization (5150 in CA) due to danger to herself/others.  Could be related to illicit drug abuse, but something more benign might have precipitated a psychotic break, too.  Plenty of bipolars and schizophrenics don’t take the meds that keep them on the straight and narrow.

Offline David in MN

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #10 on: November 06, 2018, 02:56:44 PM »
Might have been an involuntary psychiatric hospitalization (5150 in CA) due to danger to herself/others.  Could be related to illicit drug abuse, but something more benign might have precipitated a psychotic break, too.  Plenty of bipolars and schizophrenics don’t take the meds that keep them on the straight and narrow.

Yes, I realize it's in the cards. If I'm honest I assume drugs because when we met the Spidey Sense went off. Could be something much less serious.

I'm not looking to be the next Charles Bronson, I just want a little safety at home. There are a few red flags and it's becoming a pattern. I agree with the wiser half that locking up and having strict protocols is the right course.

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #11 on: November 06, 2018, 03:26:27 PM »
One thing you should record is make, model, color, and license plate number of each vehicle.  If something does happen with one of the frequent visitors, this will be very valuable for police in identifying and locating them.

Offline David in MN

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2018, 09:03:28 AM »
She's gone. As in she showed up with 4 girlfriends and cleared her stuff (best I can figure). Cracked a beer with the other neighbor last night and he tells me I've got the story all wrong. They were never together and she was basically a squat.

What?!? We went over and greeted them with a plate of cookies when they moved in. Back when it was him, her, and the boy. We gave them slices of my daughter's birthday cake. When there were three people there and they sure acted like a family. Of course that was before they had a teenage girl, an odd guy who spends the nights, and a boyfriend who might be there.

I'm trying to be polite but these aren't normal behaviors. I mean it's not like getting a little drunk at a cocktail party. Normal people don't have 10 cars visit in a day, have random numbers of people sleeping there, give false ideas about family structure, get arrested, need a small armada of ladies to pull out your clothes, on and on. It's not the next door neighbor who had a fender bender and came home grumpy.

I'm ashamed to admit it but I am recording license plates. The last renter was a train wreck but it was all domestic. This is more like a never ending parade. The Mrs. is having nightmares. But what more can I ethically do? I would feel like a waste calling the police without witnessing a real crime. And they've been there. They've seen the meth mouth and the jitters that made us nervous. It's a mess.

Offline scoop

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2018, 11:06:16 AM »
Complain to the landlord, get them evicted.

Offline cmxterra

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2018, 01:22:36 PM »
Arlo Pro Cameras get them now. Place them accordingly.

Offline David in MN

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #15 on: November 15, 2018, 02:05:14 PM »
Complain to the landlord, get them evicted.

Yeah, he's got to be a hero. The last couple were a domestic abuse nightmare and I saw both arrested. This couple clearly have at the least mental health issues and at the worst some form of crack or meth problem. Again, these aren't normal behaviors. If I'm honest when the landlord meets me my advice would be to duck.

Arlo Pro Cameras get them now. Place them accordingly.

Yeah, we're having that convo nightly. I want to pollute the yard with cameras and the Mrs. is staunchly opposed. It's an "arguments on both sides make sense" situation. I want safety; she wants good relationships. What can I say?

I'm up to 5 license plates of people who (in my head) don't live there. That's today and I took my preschooler to school, spent 2 hours in my shop, picked her up, went to lunch, and taught (somewhat) how to play the harmonica. I'm a bad nosy neighbor and I saw 5 vehicles?

This is not fun. I'm in a pickle.

Offline cmxterra

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #16 on: November 15, 2018, 02:59:41 PM »
There are several nice things about the Arlo cameras.  Wireless so you can move them till you find the spot you like. You can get skins for them to make them vanish into their surroundings and 1080 HD. Night use is also rather impressive.

Offline Morning Sunshine

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #17 on: November 15, 2018, 03:02:52 PM »
CMX - haven't seen you in a while.  welcome back.

I agree with the camera and the landlord.  Any chance you could buy that house?  If only to resell it to the first "normal" person who wants to live there.

Online FreeLancer

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #18 on: November 15, 2018, 03:54:51 PM »
There are several nice things about the Arlo cameras.  Wireless so you can move them till you find the spot you like. You can get skins for them to make them vanish into their surroundings and 1080 HD. Night use is also rather impressive.

Indeed.  I love mine.

Offline Sailor

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #19 on: November 16, 2018, 01:57:43 PM »
I put those Arlo Pros at my parents house a while back and they frustrated the heck out of me.  I like my wired $25 wyze cams better.  I did not have the option to set up motion zones, and the things false alerted all the time with shadows,  sun spots etc.  Then we had them lock into night mode only.  Hopefully they have gotten better. 

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #20 on: November 16, 2018, 02:19:31 PM »
Only problem I've had with the Arlo Pro 2 cams is unwanted triggering from wind moving stuff in range of the camera, which will use up a battery charge in a day, easily resolved with repositioning. 

Offline David in MN

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #21 on: November 16, 2018, 02:42:24 PM »
CMX - haven't seen you in a while.  welcome back.

I agree with the camera and the landlord.  Any chance you could buy that house?  If only to resell it to the first "normal" person who wants to live there.

Buy the house? Now that's outside the box. I'm actually sure I could. 20% down on a house ~200k is only $40k. Yeah, I could swing that pretty easy. I wonder what the laws are to claim my 3 year old as the owner? Not that I really want to deal with fixing a rental.

Actually it has been a mostly positive exercise. We're being very aware, keeping everything locked, and lights on. Boring security stuff but it works. If I'm honest I grew up with very poor security skills. When you're next to a corn farm trouble just isn't that close. So having a protocol of locking up and keeping lights on feels good.

Today I got out and trimmed some bushes and cleaned up some hedges. Put a motion sensor light out back. Put a motion sensor light out front. I'd like a camera but it's still a little bit of a "polite MN faux pas". The Mrs. is holding a line there.

Offline David in MN

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #22 on: November 17, 2018, 04:16:45 PM »
Flip flop of the century. He's out; she's in. It's like the time old tale. You move in as 3, become 7, she gets arrested, the kid disappears, she leaves in a Honda, she returns in a Chevy, he drives a Ford away, he returns in a VW to pick up his crap. A tale as old as time.

As bad as it sounds I'm actually happy. Sorry to be sexist but 95% of violent crime is men. I'll take a strung out lady over a enterprising man any day. Not hating on my gender but come on, we're the ones that cause the real trouble.

Keeping up protocol though.

Offline Stwood

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #23 on: November 18, 2018, 10:55:01 PM »
Maybe he had enough of the BS, and decided to pack.
Boy you never know................

Offline cmxterra

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #24 on: November 19, 2018, 06:21:55 AM »
Now is the time for cameras.. when he comes back drunk at 1 am to start crap.

Offline David in MN

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #25 on: November 19, 2018, 08:05:03 AM »
Now is the time for cameras.. when he comes back drunk at 1 am to start crap.

I agree. Still a tussle with the Mrs. To be fair she has a point. It's not my business. And it's cold out. Cold keeps the crazies off the streets.

Maybe he had enough of the BS, and decided to pack.
Boy you never know................

Honestly that's the scary part. You don't know anything. I could be looking at a benign psych med issue paired with the usual family stress. Or it could be a full fledged methlab. I'm seeing the smoke and guessing the fire.

Offline cmxterra

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #26 on: November 19, 2018, 01:48:42 PM »
I agree. Still a tussle with the Mrs. To be fair she has a point. It's not my business. And it's cold out. Cold keeps the crazies off the streets.

Honestly that's the scary part. You don't know anything. I could be looking at a benign psych med issue paired with the usual family stress. Or it could be a full fledged methlab. I'm seeing the smoke and guessing the fire.

On that we will disagree. All things that can affect me or my family is my business. Having those people at your door most assuredly is yours. Living in MN myself I know how cold keep the crazy mostly contained. But thinking worst case. Bullets flying from the warmth of one household to the next care not about the cold between them.

Offline David in MN

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #27 on: December 02, 2018, 12:22:53 PM »
He's back. You can't write this story.

Got a couple inches of snow yesterday so I was out shoveling this morning and saw my next door neighbor chatting with the older woman moving out. I went and said hi and talked about the snow and things rapidly came around to "the crazy house". After some polite banter about how the last couple were worse I laughingly dipped my toe in the water by saying, "but what can you do beyond keeping the shotgun gassed up?"

And that's when my little old lady neighbor laughed and admitted they had their shotgun out and ready. My next door neighbor laughed and said something like his shotgun was next to the bed too. I guess I'm not alone in wanting the gauge close at hand.

I got the name of the owner. Not sure how I should pursue that angle. There might be a nice way to say "clearly you give zero Fs about who you stick in our sleepy subdivision".

Offline Stwood

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #28 on: December 02, 2018, 12:46:48 PM »
Ask em if they do back ground checks, just as a general question

Offline Alan Georges

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Re: Security Protocol in a Now Unsafe Area
« Reply #29 on: December 02, 2018, 12:48:55 PM »
At least you have *some* good neighbors, David.