Author Topic: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China  (Read 45288 times)

Offline Mona

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1110 on: May 12, 2020, 06:03:48 AM »
Appropriate PPE?! If mentally at all possible worn by the patients as well.


The idea of dieing patients recieving visits Jack mentioned in one of his previous podcast made me picture Hotels repurposed as paliative meeting places with total quarantine of the visitors until a certainty that they haven't been infected has been accieved. As much as families want to see their loved one one last time I don't think they'd be willing to under those circumstances.

Offline David in MN

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1111 on: May 12, 2020, 07:19:49 AM »
There's controversy about whether COVID-19 infections and deaths are overcounted or undercounted.  So the best way to avoid this is to look at ALL daths from ALL causes, and see whether there have been any obvious changes.

Financial Times has done exactly that:



Lots more graphs and info in this regularly-updated article:

FT, 5/11/20: Coronavirus tracked: the latest figures as countries fight to contain the pandemic | Free to read

But those are bad numbers too. It has the built in bias error that we are treating only one underlying condition so the massive uptick in death from untreated illness, suicide, alcoholism, and other forms of death by despair get lumped in to COVID which is a bad data set. We also still lack any (what I would call) texture to the data.

Let me put it this way... If we nixed New York and New Jersey from our sample the USA would be on par with the lowest global case rate per capita. Does that mean that NYC mismanaged this disaster? I don't know. I don't have the rich data to tell me that this was shot through young healthy people riding the subway versus elderly retired people who never ride the subway.

I sympathize that we have no good data and the people in power have done their damndest to prevent us from getting a good data set to base our decisions upon but I'm still looking. Right now my best hope are the statisticians at the University of Chicago but the Londoners are giving them a run for the money. I really don't like the University of Washington model and the University of Minnesota model has yet to play out so it's a statistical unknown.

Offline Carver

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1112 on: May 12, 2020, 09:53:08 AM »
Gov Cuomo referred to Covid-19 as the "European" virus; I suggest here in the Midwest we call it the "Cuomo" virus.

Offline fred.greek

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1113 on: May 12, 2020, 05:01:29 PM »
Per 1 million population.

China 58 cases, 3 deaths.

USA 4,247 cases, 251 deaths, or case rate is 73x &  death rate at 83x that of China.

China is the highest populated nation on earth, with crowded crappy living conditions for most of its citizens.  It was the epicenter of this pandemic. 

    If a natural event, they should have been MUCH worse off than the rest of the world.
    Luck?
    If you know a specific virus is coming, being prepared to handle it is much easier. 

China went from being maligned in the media to being praised. 

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

Offline mountainmoma

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1114 on: May 12, 2020, 09:46:11 PM »
Per 1 million population.

China 58 cases, 3 deaths.

USA 4,247 cases, 251 deaths, or case rate is 73x &  death rate at 83x that of China.

China is the highest populated nation on earth, with crowded crappy living conditions for most of its citizens.  It was the epicenter of this pandemic. 

    If a natural event, they should have been MUCH worse off than the rest of the world.
    Luck?
    If you know a specific virus is coming, being prepared to handle it is much easier. 

China went from being maligned in the media to being praised. 

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

DOnt you think it is much more likely that they lied and those are not true statistics ?

Offline David in MN

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1115 on: May 13, 2020, 07:18:02 AM »
We're not being honest in our math either. Keeping it local to MN 81% of our deaths are from nursing homes. That is a number that should stagger anyone. Basically the data are telling us we didn't do enough to protect at-risk elderly people confined together.

I will add that we might be an outlier in that only the dumbest people retire in MN because we tax retirement income as a salary so we're like one of Forbes' 5 worst states to retire in but that said we didn't have a policy to protect our elderly. And that's from a state that really prides itself on our strong medical care. We take a little pride between the University and Mayo.

Offline Mr. Bill

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1116 on: May 13, 2020, 07:55:37 AM »
But those are bad numbers too. It has the built in bias error that we are treating only one underlying condition so the massive uptick in death from untreated illness, suicide, alcoholism, and other forms of death by despair get lumped in to COVID which is a bad data set. ...

This is true, and I recall that FT acknowledged this flaw either in the article I linked or in an earlier one that was specifically about excess deaths.

The one thing we can say for certain is that Something Really Bad happened in March and April, and lots of people died.  But if you were to focus only on excess deaths data and nothing else, you could argue that all of the deaths were due to government edicts and zero were due to COVID-19.

This is what I'm seeing a lot: someone waving a number around yelling "Look! I have a statistic!" and saying that it proves what they previously believed to be true anyway.  We have to look at the totality of the evidence, to the extent that's available and comprehensible to us non-epidemiologists, but largely, we're not.

Offline surfivor

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1117 on: May 13, 2020, 10:35:31 AM »
 let me know when they figure out so I know when I can leave my house


 If China was in on it somehow through globalist back channels, they could have just been instructed to quarantine a city to give more credence to the whole thing
« Last Edit: May 13, 2020, 10:45:03 AM by surfivor »

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1118 on: May 13, 2020, 02:03:46 PM »
In Indiana Governor briefing they announced results of a 4,611 random person study from mid April to May 1 courtesy of IU medical. Preliminary results suggest:

2.8% of Hoosiers infected (estimated 186,000 out of 6,700,000) with 1.7% with active infections and 1.1 percent previously infected (from antibodies)
Mortality rate is 0.58%
44.8% of those infected have shown no symptoms

This is the highest quality study done to date.  They are delving into results more including isolating areas of greatest areas of prevalence and taking action.  For example, we are moving testing sites into certain minority communities.  We are continuing additional waves to monitor situation as we continue to ramp up businesses and schools.

Offline David in MN

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1119 on: May 13, 2020, 04:12:29 PM »
This is true, and I recall that FT acknowledged this flaw either in the article I linked or in an earlier one that was specifically about excess deaths.

The one thing we can say for certain is that Something Really Bad happened in March and April, and lots of people died.  But if you were to focus only on excess deaths data and nothing else, you could argue that all of the deaths were due to government edicts and zero were due to COVID-19.

This is what I'm seeing a lot: someone waving a number around yelling "Look! I have a statistic!" and saying that it proves what they previously believed to be true anyway.  We have to look at the totality of the evidence, to the extent that's available and comprehensible to us non-epidemiologists, but largely, we're not.

I agree. It's so absolutely insane that CNN had Greta on their COVID panel. Think what you will of a learning disabled Swede high school dropout but her expertise isn't plague or statistics. She's a climate science celebrity.

I am angered to no end with the complete lack of information. We're 6 months in and the best we can do is simultaneously praise South Korea and Sweden which took diametrically opposed positions. That's not a science based approach. We need to compare different strategies in a dispassionate data driven model and not a "confirmed my priors" where any right brained math type would hang his head in shame and resign in disgrace.

And I'm acutely aware that I am falling into what Dan Carlin would call "I want Caesar" because everyone is behaving like children and pooping on the playground. I would be on board in a hurry for the cult leader with a modicum of math understanding. That isn't the best strategy either. As Michael Malice likes to say when you let us engineers run the show you get the Soviet Union.

If I find good, usable data I will post it. But that isn't happening right now.

Offline Mona

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1120 on: May 13, 2020, 06:09:15 PM »
Something I found interesting was a table of average years of live lost, in parrallel to  the average livespan corrected for the applicable comorbideties

Lost years compared to normal life expectation
Bundesland                    male   female   male (corr.*)   fem. (corr.*)
Bremen                            15,4   7,3           14,2                   6,7
Mecklenburg-Vorpommern    12,3   13,9           11,4                   12,7
Berlin                            12           10,5           11,1                    9,6
Saarland                            11,6   8,5           10,7                    7,8
Hessen                            11,5   9           10,6                    8,2
Sachsen-Anhalt                    11,4   7,6           10,5                     7
Schleswig-Holstein            11,1   9,8           10,2                     9
Rheinland-Pfalz                    11           9,8           10,2                    9
Hamburg                            10,9   10,4           10,1                    9,5
Baden-Württemberg            10,8   9,3           10                    8,5
Bayern                            10,8   9,4           10                    8,6
Nordrhein-Westfalen            10,8   9,3           10                    8,5
Niedersachsen                    10,1   9           9,3                    8,2
Thüringen                            10,1   8,4           9,3                    7,7
Brandenburg                     9,9           10,2           9,1                    9,3
Sachsen                             9,8           10,2           9                    9,3

* corrected for the influence of underlieing illnesses as used in a british studie of the same phenomenon
*korrigiert um den Einfluss von Vorerkrankungen gemäß den Abschlägen in der britischer Studie

Appearanty the overall average is 9 years.
https://www.tagesschau.de/investigativ/ndr/corona-lebenserwartung-101.html

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1121 on: May 14, 2020, 06:51:05 PM »
https://www.wsj.com/articles/new-york-sent-recovering-coronavirus-patients-to-nursing-homes-it-was-a-fatal-error-11589470773
New York Sent Recovering Coronavirus Patients to Nursing Homes: ‘It Was a Fatal Error’

Offline Morning Sunshine

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1122 on: May 14, 2020, 06:58:43 PM »
https://www.wsj.com/articles/new-york-sent-recovering-coronavirus-patients-to-nursing-homes-it-was-a-fatal-error-11589470773
New York Sent Recovering Coronavirus Patients to Nursing Homes: ‘It Was a Fatal Error’

"Fatal Error" ???  that is putting it mildly.  And these people have the nerve to attack President Trump's response, and the actions of governors who did NOT shut down their states.

Offline ChEng

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1123 on: May 15, 2020, 04:20:50 AM »
That's putting it mildly - Mrs. ChEng believes that those governors who did this need to be charged with murder.

Our State Health Secretary knew that this was going to cause deaths before he/she gave the order and moved his/her mother out of a nursing home. (Dealing with these people who cannot tell whether they are male or female is awkward.  ::) )

https://dailycaller.com/2020/05/13/coronavirus-pennsylvania-rachel-levine-mother-nursing-home/?fbclid=IwAR0l3UrKkZLXQyLdsO2bSQsnazJvTZoGizpUOz0KFEeOPZu_SijoelTwr88

And, many states did this, not just our Democrat-run state. https://www.buckscountycouriertimes.com/news/20200501/states-ordered-nursing-homes-to-take-covid-19-residents-thousands-died-how-it-happened

But is anyone going to pay for their crimes? No! They were all making their decisions based on "Science" - regardless of the fact that they would not recognize science if it bit them in the rear end. Democrats seem to be protected, no matter how stupid/criminal their behavior is.

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1124 on: May 15, 2020, 06:47:17 PM »
LA doctor finding same results as French doctor.  He cites need for zinc.  Which goes along with earlier findings that while some people may have high enough concentrations of zinc in body, others may need supplements for maximum potency.

https://abc7.com/amp/coronavirus-drug-covid-19-malaria-hydroxychloroquine/6079864/
LA DOCTOR SEEING SUCCESS WITH HYDROXYCHLOROQUINE TO TREAT COVID-19

LOS ANGELES (KABC) -- A Los Angeles doctor said he is seeing significant success in prescribing the malaria drug hydroxychloroquine in combination with zinc to treat patients with severe symptoms of COVID-19.
...
Dr. Anthony Cardillo said he has seen very promising results when prescribing hydroxychloroquine in combination with zinc for the most severely-ill COVID-19 patients.

"Every patient I've prescribed it to has been very, very ill and within 8 to 12 hours, they were basically symptom-free," Cardillo told Eyewitness News. "So clinically I am seeing a resolution."
...
He said he has found it only works if combined with zinc. The drug, he said, opens a channel for the zinc to enter the cell and block virus replication


First major retrospective study on adding Zinc to combined Hydroxychloroquin/Axithromycin therapy is in preprint.  Results confirm earlier, anecdotal case studies.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.02.20080036v1
Hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin plus zinc vs hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin alone: outcomes in hospitalized COVID-19 patients

In univariate analyses, zinc sulfate increased the frequency of patients being discharged home, and decreased the need for ventilation, admission to the ICU, and mortality or transfer to hospice for patients who were never admitted to the ICU. After adjusting for the time at which zinc sulfate was added to our protocol, an increased frequency of being discharged home (OR 1.53, 95% CI 1.12-2.09) reduction in mortality or transfer to hospice remained significant (OR 0.449, 95% CI 0.271-0.744). Conclusion: This study provides the first in vivo evidence that zinc sulfate in combination with hydroxychloroquine may play a role in therapeutic management for COVID-19.


Offline FreeLancer

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1125 on: May 15, 2020, 10:38:12 PM »
Retrospective, not peer reviewed, and an OR with a confidence interval near 1 (no effect) but might be 2 (pretty good effect) that doesn’t lend much confidence.

We need prospective data to support a solid RR, and that takes a proper double blinded randomized controlled clinical trial.

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1126 on: May 17, 2020, 08:23:36 PM »
Does anyone take CNN coverage of the pandemic seriously anymore?

May 15 newscycle:

https://www.mediaite.com/trump/cnns-kaitlan-collins-confronts-trump-over-officials-including-trump-not-wearing-masks-at-vaccine-presser/
CNN’s Kaitlan Collins Confronts Trump Over Officials, Including Trump, Not Wearing Masks at Vaccine Presser

“Mr. President, can you just clarify why are some of you wearing a mask and why are some of you not wearing a mask?”

May 16 newscycle:

https://nypost.com/2020/05/16/cnn-reporter-caught-removing-face-mask-when-she-thought-camera-was-off/
CNN reporter Kaitlan Collins caught removing face mask when she thought camera was off

CNN White House correspondent Kaitlan Collins may have worn her mask during the White House press briefing Friday, but she promptly removed the facial covering when the cameras were off — or so she thought

Offline David in MN

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1127 on: May 18, 2020, 02:00:51 PM »
How about some positivity?

We have almost perfectly flattened the curve.

There are several vaccines and therapeudics in clinical trials sooner than expected.

Many states, including hardest hit New York have surplus testing which really helps people make  good decisions and provides much needed data for researchers.

The researchers are now saying we may have way overestimated the number of effected people because anyone who died with COVID was classified as a COVID fatality even if the cause of death was unrelated.

The greatest vector in most states is nursing homes. Now that's tragic and I wish we had managed it better but we at least are learning this and trying to protect people at risk. And I can't helpp but wonder how it would look if it was kids dying at a higher frequency. We'd lose our minds. That's the real nnightmare.

States are re-opening and with the enhanced testing we can be a little more sagacious as we return to some form of normalcy.

And last I'll say that most people did mostly good. I can't speak for everyone but around here we pretty much followed the rules for distancing and while some things were tough neighbors looked after each other.

Today I saw the light at the end of the tunnel. The news is very positive even in NYC. There may be reason to be Matt Ridley's "Rational Optimist".

Offline FreeLancer

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1128 on: May 18, 2020, 09:51:48 PM »
Cumulative Cases/Deaths per Million Population

Nation/State         Cases/mil Deaths/mil
Belgium4,796 784
Spain5,950593
Italy3,735529
UK 3,632513
France2,757433
Sweden3,010366
US4,687278
Canada  2,071155
Germany2,11797
Turkey1,78850
Norway1,52443
Czechia80228
Greece27216
Japan 1296
S Korea2165
--- --- ---
New York18,5711,464
New Jersey16,8981,176
Connecticut 10,691967
Massachusetts 12,630850
Louisiana7,466551
Michigan5,198492
Rhode Island  12,078478
Pennsylvania 5,208365
Maryland 6,577335
Illinois 7,614334
Delaware 8,081305
Indiana 4,197262
Colorado 3,855213
Mississippi 3,841177
Georgia 3,606155
Ohio 2,437142
Washington2,562134
Minnesota 2,903131
New Mexico ^x32,907129
New Hampshire ^x22,686126
Virginia ^x13,648119
Nevada 2,242116
Iowa ^x14,781115
Alabama ^x32,465100
Missouri ^x11,825100
Arizona ^x21,94794
Florida ^x12,16293
Vermont 1,50687
California 2,06884
Wisconsin 2,17979
Kentucky ^x11,77677
South Carolina ^x11,73776
Oklahoma 1,36473
Kansas 2,86368
North Carolina  1,83166
Nebraska 5,49365
North Dakota ^x12,53458
Maine 1,27453
South Dakota ^x14,55250
Texas 1,71347
Tennessee ^x12,63744
Idaho 1,37441
West Virginia ^x283838
Arkansas 1,59533
Oregon 87433
Utah 2,30325
Wyoming ^x21,32417
Montana 44014
Alaska 54514
Hawaii 45212


Global deaths are now at 320k, with 92k of those in the US.


A few big movers over the last week within the states, but overall things seem to be stabilizing. 

However, this is where we stand after a massive lockdown across the Western Democracies. 


We'll see what happens over the summer (where the warmer weather may be found to reduce transmission) as these restrictions are eased. 

And then, the next big unknown, Fall and Winter going into 2021.

At this point, there's insufficient evidence that the antibodies produced after recovering from COVID provides immunity against reinfection and vaccine efficacy, while promising, also remains to be seen.


One way or the other, we will learn a lot about how this virus behaves over the next 12 months.

Offline Greekman

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1129 on: May 19, 2020, 12:34:10 AM »
Quote
One way or the other, we will learn a lot about how this virus behaves over the next 12 months.

pn that level, we will, no doubt, but I am highly skeptical if we will accept -intellectually- what is going on.
Cannot know what is happening in the US but over here the success, the dearth of victims, and the mass media scare tactics,  has made almost all people either deny the severity of the virus or even the existence of.
Personally I have stopped discussing the matter with people cos they treat me like a basket case when I talk data FOR the importance.
Honestly, I dread the instance that I will run into one that will be denying the very existence of microrganisms in general,  cos he cannot see them.

In that regard, i think humanity has missed the trained and we have stepped backwards.

Offline surfivor

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1130 on: May 19, 2020, 08:33:32 AM »
pn that level, we will, no doubt, but I am highly skeptical if we will accept -intellectually- what is going on.
Cannot know what is happening in the US but over here the success, the dearth of victims, and the mass media scare tactics,  has made almost all people either deny the severity of the virus or even the existence of.
Personally I have stopped discussing the matter with people cos they treat me like a basket case when I talk data FOR the importance.
Honestly, I dread the instance that I will run into one that will be denying the very existence of microrganisms in general,  cos he cannot see them.

In that regard, i think humanity has missed the trained and we have stepped backwards.

 There may be microcosms but if all these people test positive but they are not sick and have no symptoms then there are many questions and I would not accept medical authorities directions and especially if there are other interpretations from other medical professionals or scientists

Offline FreeLancer

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1131 on: May 19, 2020, 04:17:40 PM »
CDC MMWR Early Release:  High COVID-19 Attack Rate Among Attendees at Events at a Church — Arkansas, March 2020

Quote
On March 16, 2020, the day that national social distancing guidelines were released (1), the Arkansas Department of Health (ADH) was notified of two cases of coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) from a rural county of approximately 25,000 persons; these cases were the first identified in this county. The two cases occurred in a husband and wife; the husband is the pastor at a local church (church A). The couple (the index cases) attended church-related events during March 6–8, and developed nonspecific respiratory symptoms and fever on March 10 (wife) and 11 (husband). Before his symptoms had developed, the husband attended a Bible study group on March 11. Including the index cases, 35 confirmed COVID-19 cases occurred among 92 (38%) persons who attended events held at church A during March 6–11; three patients died. The age-specific attack rates among persons aged ≤18 years, 19–64 years, and ≥65 years were 6.3%, 59.4%, and 50.0%, respectively. During contact tracing, at least 26 additional persons with confirmed COVID-19 cases were identified among community members who reported contact with church A attendees and likely were infected by them; one of the additional persons was hospitalized and subsequently died. This outbreak highlights the potential for widespread transmission of SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19, both at group gatherings during church events and within the broader community. These findings underscore the opportunity for faith-based organizations to prevent COVID-19 by following local authorities’ guidance and the U.S. Government’s Guidelines: Opening Up America Again (2) regarding modification of activities to prevent virus transmission during the COVID-19 pandemic.




Fox News reporting on this outbreak from a month ago:  Arkansas pastor, wife, 'dozens' in church infected with COVID-19, he says

Quote
The pastor also urged his followers to heed the instructions of health authorities on social distancing and hand-washing.

“We must keep the affected population to as a low a number as possible,” he wrote. “Our singular act of stubborn independence can have far-reaching effects on someone else’s life.”

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1132 on: May 19, 2020, 05:29:19 PM »
We have reached peak nutiness now in media on COVID-19. 

https://www.businessinsider.com/top-coronavirus-researcher-florida-fired-as-state-reopens-data-2020-5
Top Florida coronavirus researcher said she was fired as the state reopened because she refused to 'manually change data'

She is a journalism and geography major who was in charge of look of dashboard.  She was a mid-level manager primarily concerned with look and feel things like the color combinations:

“You’ll notice the dashboard has a lot of oranges, yellows, and blues—Florida colors—because I didn’t want to frighten people,” Jones said. “I had to fight to keep from putting red anywhere. People are terrified, and red initiates a primal feeling of fear.”

She was reportedly fired after multiple instances of insubordination with the team of epidemiologists.  I understand journalists protecting their own and trying to generate clicks, but come on, elevating her to being the "Top Florida Coronavirus Researcher" is just crazy.  She is a journalist who makes pretty maps and writes simple trend code. 

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1133 on: May 19, 2020, 05:54:56 PM »
We have reached peak nutiness now in media on COVID-19. 

https://www.businessinsider.com/top-coronavirus-researcher-florida-fired-as-state-reopens-data-2020-5
Top Florida coronavirus researcher said she was fired as the state reopened because she refused to 'manually change data'

She is a journalism and geography major who was in charge of look of dashboard.  She was a mid-level manager primarily concerned with look and feel things like the color combinations:

“You’ll notice the dashboard has a lot of oranges, yellows, and blues—Florida colors—because I didn’t want to frighten people,” Jones said. “I had to fight to keep from putting red anywhere. People are terrified, and red initiates a primal feeling of fear.”

She was reportedly fired after multiple instances of insubordination with the team of epidemiologists.  I understand journalists protecting their own and trying to generate clicks, but come on, elevating her to being the "Top Florida Coronavirus Researcher" is just crazy.  She is a journalist who makes pretty maps and writes simple trend code.

Well, i see that the major news outlets are now correcting their headlines by replacing "researcher", "scientist", and "investigator" with "manager", "architect", "dashboard designer", "person", and "woman".  Those were some quick retractions.

https://www.wtsp.com/article/news/health/coronavirus/ron-desantis-rebekah-jones-coronavirus-dashboard-non-issue/67-7f55db89-0a9a-456b-9fe8-fef032b162e7
DeSantis: It's a 'non-issue' that woman who designed Florida's coronavirus dashboard was ousted

The state has released its own statement about the matter, offering a different characterization of Jones' removal. The state's statement reads in part:

"Rebekah Jones exhibited a repeated course of insubordination during her time with the Department, including her unilateral decisions to modify the Department’s COVID-19 dashboard without input or approval from the epidemiological team or her supervisors. The blatant disrespect for the professionals who were working around the clock to provide the important information for the COVID-19 website was harmful to the team.

Accuracy and transparency are always indispensable, especially during an unprecedented public health emergency such as COVID-19.  Having someone disruptive cannot be tolerated during this public pandemic, which led the Department to determine that it was best to terminate her employment."
...
When asked about the situation by a reporter during a news conference, DeSantis described Jones' removal as a "non-issue." He read from an email he said Jones sent to her boss.

10Investigates has obtained a copy of that email.

It was sent on May 16 from Jones to Craig Curry, director of IT for the Florida Department of Health. It says:

"So I sent an email to data users to tell them I'm off the dashboard, I can't answer their questions (aka please stop emailing me 24/7), gave them the info needed to get their API links fixed, etc., and now a reporter has called me asking why I'm not on it anymore. I said I'm not allowed to do interviews with the press. I said they've got a team working on it now, and that what I meant when I said don't expect the same level of accessibility is that they are busy and can't answer every single email they get right away, and that it was ridiculous that I managed to do it in the first place, and that I was tired and needed a break from working two months straight and am finally taking a vacation..

Is this one of those stupid things I should've have said? I sent this yesterday about the time my vpn/email got glitchy, but it looks like it wasn't actually sent until my passwords were reset... I have them the updated info and everything. I really don't want this to be a story, but this lady has called me like three times.

Please help me."

« Last Edit: May 19, 2020, 06:22:06 PM by iam4liberty »

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1134 on: May 20, 2020, 05:43:56 PM »
A bit of good news:

ArsTechnica, 5/19/20: Recovered COVID-19 patients test positive but not infectious, data finds

Quote
People who recover from COVID-19 but test positive for the virus again days or weeks later are not shedding viral particles and are not infectious, according to data released Tuesday by the Korea Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. ...

KCDC researchers examined 285 cases that had previously recovered from COVID-19 but then tested positive again. The patients tested positive again anywhere from one to 37 days after recovering from their first infection and being discharged from isolation. The average time to a second positive was about 14 days.

Of those cases, researchers checked for symptoms in 284 of them. They found that 126 (about 48 percent) did indeed have symptoms related to COVID-19.

But none of them seemed to have spread the infection. KCDC investigated 790 people who had close contact with the 285 cases and found that none of them had been infected by the “re-positive” cases.

Crucially, additional testing of 108 “re-positive” cases found that none of them were shedding infectious virus. ...

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1135 on: May 20, 2020, 05:53:16 PM »
A bit of good news:

ArsTechnica, 5/19/20: Recovered COVID-19 patients test positive but not infectious, data finds

That is good news   Though it does beg question if it causes some more long term respiratory damage in some people. Let's hope not.

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1137 on: May 21, 2020, 08:35:59 PM »
The beuracrats wouldn't listen about the inflated model projections, ventilators, or nursing homes, will they listen about this?

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/doctors-raise-alarm-about-health-effects-of-continued-coronavirus-shutdown
Doctors raise alarm about health effects of continued coronavirus shutdown: 'Mass casualty incident'

The letter outlines a variety of consequences that the doctors have observed resulting from the coronavirus shutdowns, including patients missing routine checkups that could detect things like heart problems or cancer, increases in substance and alcohol abuse, and increases in financial instability that could lead to "[p]overty and financial uncertainty," which "is closely linked to poor health."

"We are alarmed at what appears to be the lack of consideration for the future health of our patients," the doctors say in their letter. "The downstream health effects ... are being massively under-estimated and under-reported. This is an order of magnitude error."
...
"The very initial argument ... which sounded reasonable three months ago, is that in order to limit the overwhelmed patient flux into hospitals that would prevent adequate care, we needed to spread out the infections and thus the deaths in specific locales that could become hotspots, particularly New York City... It was a valid argument at the beginning based on the models that were given," McDonald said. "What we've seen now over the last three months is that no city -- none, zero -- outside of New York has even been significantly stressed."

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1138 on: May 21, 2020, 09:19:12 PM »
Quote
A Doctor a Day has not yet formally launched but sent the letter, with hundreds of signatures from physicians nationwide, to the White House on Tuesday.


A Doctor a Day?

Who dat?

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Re: Coronavirus COVID-19 (a.k.a. 2019-nCoV) outbreak in China
« Reply #1139 on: May 21, 2020, 11:08:22 PM »

A Doctor a Day?

Who dat?

They list several leaders in the article.  Looks like a bunch of really intelligent and competent doctors, many with PhDs, JDs,  and MBAs in addition to MDs/DOs from prestigious schools. Here is bio of one of the founders:

http://www.drsimonegold.com/bio.html
About Dr. Gold
Simone Gold, MD, JD graduated from Chicago Medical School before attending Stanford University Law School. She completed her residency in Emergency Medicine at Stony Brook University Hospital in New York. Currently she splits her professional time between working as a trauma/emergency physician and consulting as a C-Suite Physician. Her training and experience as an emergency physician proved to be the ideal background to understand, and communicate within, any medical subspecialty. Her legal training makes her unusually precise at discovering the optimum treatment and unusually effective at managing the many interpersonal communications needed to ensure each patient's ideal solution.

Dr. Gold has had a life-long interest in health policy. She worked as an Instructor in Health Law at Stanford Medical School as well as serving as a physician-attorney advisor for hospital-clients with Medicare and Medicaid appeals. She is a published author and editor of several magazine and newspaper articles and is the co-founder of IRFdefend, comprehensive appeals software for rehabilitation hospitals.

Dr. Gold was a Congressional Fellow for the United States Senate Labor & Human Resources Committee and has received a number of prestigious awards including the United States Public Health Service Award. She holds a physician and surgeon license in California and New York and is a diplomate of the American Board of Emergency Medicine (ABEM). In addition she is a member of the Bar in the states of New York and Illinois.