Author Topic: Virus accidentally released from lab ?  (Read 12812 times)

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #240 on: May 11, 2020, 07:32:30 AM »
Prior to the current regime, China has always cooperated with international investigations as per treaties.  And they routinely admitted to the lab leaks.  So the big question now is why they have changed?

https://www.biospace.com/article/around-the-web/china-reports-sars-death-caused-by-lab-leak/
China Reports SARS Death Caused By Lab Leak

Published: Apr 26, 2004
Chinese health officials have confirmed four suspected cases of severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS), including one death, which appear to have been caused by a safety breach at a laboratory studying the SARS virus.
...
The Chinese Ministry of Health says they have clinical confirmation of SARS coronavirus infection in two of the four suspected SARS cases. They are a 20-year-old nurse in Bejing who is currently in intensive care and a 26-year-old female laboratory researcher from Anhui Province. If confirmed by an independent international reference lab, this would be the third outbreak of SARS to be traced back to inadequate laboratory safety procedures.

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #241 on: May 11, 2020, 03:07:05 PM »
Very tabloidy, but accurate. 

https://www.thesun.ie/news/5375116/wuhan-lab-blamed-for-coronavirus-lied-about-safety-precautions-it-took-during-controversial-bat-tests/amp/
LAB SCANDAL Wuhan lab blamed for coronavirus LIED about safety precautions it took during controversial bat tests

THE laboratory at the heart of the world’s coronavirus pandemic lied about taking safety precautions when collecting bat samples, The Sun can exclusively reveal.

Shocking leaked photos - which reveal a scandalous lack of safety - were deleted from the website of under-fire China science hub the Wuhan Institute of Virology.
...
US and British intelligence officials suspect bungling scientists at the Wuhan Institute of Virology accidentally spread the killer disease during risky coronavirus tests on bats.

It was claimed that Covid-19 was "developed in the Wuhan lab as China hoped to prove it's greater than the US at battling deadly diseases".

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #242 on: May 12, 2020, 10:53:24 PM »
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/chinas-war-on-whistleblowers
China's war on whistleblowers

Those images of Li now serve as a symbol of just how much Communist China values truth and transparency — and the lives of its own citizens.

It doesn’t.

There’s a Chinese idiom that translates to: “Kill the chicken to scare the monkey.” It refers to making an example out of someone in order to threaten others. This is what happened to Dr. Li, Curtis S. Chin, a former U.S. ambassador to the Asian Development Bank who also worked with the Hong Kong government during the SARS epidemic, told the Washington Examiner.
...
“When I saw them circulating online, I realized that it was out of my control and I would probably be punished,” he said. He was brought down to the local Public Security Bureau in the middle of the night, reprimanded for “spreading rumors,” and forced to sign a statement admitting he “seriously disrupted social order,” thus breaching the law.

Seven other doctors were also punished for speaking the truth about the virus.
...
By merely telling the truth, Li threatened a government used to being in control. And so, Beijing has had to find a way to strengthen its grip once more.
...
“China’s problem was not a wayward Wuhan police station,” Chin said. “At the heart of China’s challenge is an authoritarian Chinese communist government system that led to cover-ups and deception.” What appears to be increasingly clear, Chin added, is that “China’s communist leaders might well fear their own people more than they do the spread of the coronavirus.”

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #243 on: May 14, 2020, 01:53:19 PM »
India's Union Minister cites virus lab origin in discussing their Micro, Small, and Medium business stimulus plan.  Also cites need for India to become more self-sufficient.

https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/virus-is-from-a-lab-not-natural-says-nitin-gadkari-to-ndtv-2228299?pfrom=home-bigstory
Virus Is From A Lab, Not Natural, Says Nitin Gadkari To NDTV

New Delhi: Union Minister Nitin Gadkari, reacting to Finance Minister Nirmala Sitharaman's announcements for small businesses hit by the coronavirus crisis and weeks of lockdown, said creating positivity in the circumstances was a challenge.
"We have to understand the art of living with corona. This is not a natural virus. It is an artificial virus and now many countries in the whole world - they are researching on it for a vaccine. The vaccine is not available, it is expected that vaccine will be available as soon as possible, then there will be no problem," Nitin Gadkari said in an interview to NDTV.

Offline Mr. Bill

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #244 on: May 14, 2020, 09:00:12 PM »
Virus Is From A Lab, Not Natural, Says Nitin Gadkari To NDTV

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitin_Gadkari

Currently:
  Minister of Road Transport and Highways
  Minister of Micro, Small and Medium Enterprises

Previously:
  President of Bharatiya Janata Party
  numerous other political positions

Business ventures:
  Poly Sack Industrial Society Ltd
  Nikhil Furniture and Appliances Pvt. Ltd
  Antyodaya Trust
  Empress Employees Co-operative Paper Mills Ltd
  Purti Power and Sugar Ltd / Purti Sakhar Karkhana Ltd
  Ketaki Overseas Trading Company

Education:
  Bachelor of Commerce (undergraduate business degree)
  Bachelor of Laws (undergraduate law degree)

With a background like this, Gadkari is definitely the person I'd trust regarding coronavirus origins, rather than all those virologists and geneticists and epidemiologists who say exactly the opposite.

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #245 on: May 14, 2020, 09:27:35 PM »
With a background like this, Gadkari is definitely the person I'd trust regarding coronavirus origins, rather than all those virologists and geneticists and epidemiologists who say exactly the opposite.

Great.  Then you will trust the Indian scientists from the school of biological sciences at IIT Delhi and Acharya Narendra Dev College of University of Delhi, right?  Or a Nobel Prize winning virologist? Or the creator of the international biotechnology treaty?

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #246 on: May 14, 2020, 10:11:06 PM »
The "experts" making up the "consensus".  LOL.  And look at the other clowns.  They even included the failed CDC bureaucrat responsible for the contaminated lab and faulty test kits.   

https://nypost.com/2020/05/13/greta-thunberg-added-to-cnn-expert-covid-19-panel-twitter-erupts/
Greta Thunberg added to CNN’s expert coronavirus panel, Twitter erupts



Offline Mr. Bill

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #247 on: May 15, 2020, 08:58:27 AM »
You've made my point for me.  Nitin Gadkari's opinion on the origin of the virus is just as newsworthy as Greta Thunberg's opinion -- i.e., not.

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #248 on: May 15, 2020, 03:58:45 PM »
You've made my point for me.  Nitin Gadkari's opinion on the origin of the virus is just as newsworthy as Greta Thunberg's opinion -- i.e., not.

Newsworthy?  Perhaps, but that just shows the deplorable state of the news industry.

Personally I think it is highly relevant that the sixth highest ranking minister in India's government says unequivically that, as a matter of policy, they view the source as a lab release and they are taking action accordingly.   Greta, by contrast, is a mentally challenged teenager with little knowledge, experience or access to information. Why do you view her opinions as so important?

But more importantly you implied that you would trust "virologists and geneticists and epidemiologists". But you are dismissing the high profile ones who have come forward.  I am just trying to understand why you are dismissing them and the vast numbers of other scientists who have come to the lab leak conclusion, especially given Chinese labs' record of leaking dangerous viruses and the mounds of evidence supporting that conclusion and no evidence supporting alternatives.

Offline surfivor

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #249 on: May 15, 2020, 04:09:48 PM »
Newsworthy?  Perhaps, but that just shows the deplorable state of the news industry.

Personally I think it is highly relevant that the sixth highest ranking minister in India's government says unequivically that, as a matter of policy, they view the source as a lab release and they are taking action accordingly.   Greta, by contrast, is a mentally challenged teenager with little knowledge, experience or access to information. Why do you view her opinions as so important?

But more importantly you implied that you would trust "virologists and geneticists and epidemiologists". But you are dismissing the high profile ones who have come forward.  I am just trying to understand why you are dismissing them and the vast numbers of other scientists who have come to the lab leak conclusion, especially given Chinese labs' record of leaking dangerous viruses and the mounds of evidence supporting that conclusion and no evidence supporting alternatives.

 I would like to see a list of names of scientists and doctors or other health professionals who have called the official narrative into question if someone has time to compile such a list. I know that Luc Antoine Montagnier  is one person on the list

Offline Mr. Bill

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #250 on: May 15, 2020, 09:52:36 PM »
Newsworthy?  Perhaps, but that just shows the deplorable state of the news industry.

Personally I think it is highly relevant that the sixth highest ranking minister in India's government says unequivically that, as a matter of policy, they view the source as a lab release and they are taking action accordingly.   Greta, by contrast, is a mentally challenged teenager with little knowledge, experience or access to information. Why do you view her opinions as so important?

You've misunderstood me.  I think Greta Thunberg's opinions on coronavirus are profoundly unimportant.  Ditto for India's "sixth highest ranking minister", and for the same reason: both are without any unusual level of expertise in the area.  They're just people who have become famous for entirely other reasons.

Asking Nitin Gadkari how the virus originated is like asking Fauci how to fund freeway construction.

But more importantly you implied that you would trust "virologists and geneticists and epidemiologists". But you are dismissing the high profile ones who have come forward.  I am just trying to understand why you are dismissing them and the vast numbers of other scientists who have come to the lab leak conclusion, especially given Chinese labs' record of leaking dangerous viruses and the mounds of evidence supporting that conclusion and no evidence supporting alternatives.

My opinions have changed as new evidence has come in, but this is how I've felt for the past few weeks:

The virus originated in bats.

It passed to humans probably by way of some other animal intermediary.  There are two plausible routes: natural, or via lab experiments designed to replicate the natural route.

From there, it escaped into the human population in or near Wuhan.  Again, there are two plausible routes: natural, or via an escape from the lab.

I don't believe we currently have evidence to distinguish between these possibilites.

I believe the "created by genetic engineering" theory has been adequately disproven at this point.  All the furor over "HIV insertions" and the like was just bad science, done in a hurry by pressured researchers who ought to have gotten some outside review before going public.

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #251 on: May 16, 2020, 10:18:34 AM »
I believe the "created by genetic engineering" theory has been adequately disproven at this point.  All the furor over "HIV insertions" and the like was just bad science, done in a hurry by pressured researchers who ought to have gotten some outside review before going public.

Interesting.  So you don't believe gain of function research was being conducted at the Wuhan Lab?  Or that this research was focused on insertions to bat coronaviruses?  The end result of which would be a coronavirus similar to that in bats naturally but with insertions that make it extremely contagious to himans but with a low mortality rate.  What evidence is there that this didn't occur,?  Because if it didn't, we should get our taxpayer dollars back from the lab.

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #252 on: May 16, 2020, 10:37:11 AM »
Uh oh.  Left media outlets are now switching gears.  After finding no scientists who will go on record saying the lab leak hypothesis isnt legit possibility, they are now blaming lab leaks on Trump.  :rofl:

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2020/05/the-non-paranoid-persons-guide-to-viruses-escaping-from-labs/
The Non-Paranoid Person’s Guide to Viruses Escaping From Labs

If anything, a lab connection would increase American culpability because the work being done at the lab was part of an international project launched in the United States—until now: Shortly after Trump embraced the lab-escape theory, in late April, the administration cut funding to EcoHealth Alliance, which helped fund the WIV lab.
...
Despite many experts’ skepticism, no one I talked to said they could confidently rule out the possibility that it accidentally escaped from a lab that was studying it.
...
Shi’s lab shouldn’t be completely cleared of possible blame until an independent body can review the lab’s records, which the Chinese government shows no signs of releasing. There’s also the possibility that the source of contamination could have been a CDC-run BSL-2 lab in Wuhan, which has reportedly worked with bat coronaviruses and is remarkably close to the city’s wet market.
...
Most of us mistakenly believe that the risk of a biolab-based pandemic is infinitesimal. But clearly Shi didn’t rule out an accidental escape from her lab. And, it turns out, she’s not alone. As much as biosecurity experts worry about nature as the source of the next pandemic, they also have grave concerns about labs.
...
Media outlets worldwide ran with the wet-market theory. Yet even in January, it was clear that the chances the coronavirus first spilled over in the market were vanishingly small.
...
Which left no firm explanation for how a virus that had originated in bats in remote caves in southern China had suddenly appeared in downtown Wuhan. Even the most common theories—that it had jumped from the bat to a person or another animal that served as an intermediate host as it traveled to Wuhan—would require a remarkable confluence of events.
...
So how do we make our labs safer? In 2014, the Obama White House took a first step, announcing a pause on gain-of-function research until the merits could be fully debated.

But in 2017, under Trump, the NIH lifted the pause, essentially agreeing with Ron Fouchier, and the work—including that which it helped fund in Wuhan—eventually went on. “GOF research is important in helping us identify, understand, and develop strategies and effective countermeasures against rapidly evolving pathogens that pose a threat to public health,” announced Francis Collins, the NIH director. Some scientists strenuously objected, such as Johns Hopkins’ Steven Salzberg, who wrote, “I can’t allow this to go unchallenged. This research is so potentially harmful, and offers such little benefit to society, that I fear that NIH is endangering the trust that Congress places in it.”

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #253 on: May 16, 2020, 10:38:54 AM »
.

Offline Mr. Bill

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #254 on: May 16, 2020, 06:51:04 PM »
Interesting.  So you don't believe gain of function research was being conducted at the Wuhan Lab?...

You posted a good Newsweek article about this:
The Controversial Experiments and Wuhan Lab Suspected of Starting the Coronavirus Pandemic

But the article claimed that the gain of function research was being done using animal passage experiments.  Animal passage is not genetic engineering, it's a laboratory version of natural viral evolution.  That's what I meant when I said "There are two plausible routes: natural, or via lab experiments designed to replicate the natural route."

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #255 on: May 16, 2020, 11:32:04 PM »
You posted a good Newsweek article about this:
The Controversial Experiments and Wuhan Lab Suspected of Starting the Coronavirus Pandemic

But the article claimed that the gain of function research was being done using animal passage experiments.  Animal passage is not genetic engineering, it's a laboratory version of natural viral evolution.  That's what I meant when I said "There are two plausible routes: natural, or via lab experiments designed to replicate the natural route."

They were doing both.

The Institute began a program of gain-of-function research into bat coronaviruses in 2015. That involved taking selected strains and seeking to increase the ability of those viruses to transmit from one person to another. The gain-of-function research went hand-in-hand with the surveillance project. As scientists identified new classes of bat viruses that have the ability to infect human cells, that raised the question of what changes would have to arise in nature to make that virus transmissible in humans, which would pose a pandemic threat.

In 2015, the Wuhan lab performed a gain of function experiment using cut-and-paste genetic engineering, in which scientists take a natural virus and directly make substitutions in its RNA coding to make it more transmissible. They took a piece of the original SARS virus and inserted a snippet from a SARS-like bat coronavirus, resulting in a virus that is capable of infecting human cells.

Offline surfivor

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #256 on: May 17, 2020, 01:23:08 AM »

We are just supposed to believe that they are not doing sketchy research or just trust such scientists when most analys of these types of things and the deep state is usually the total opposite. I find it all very annoying

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #257 on: May 17, 2020, 02:37:49 PM »
https://www.newsweek.com/scientists-shouldnt-rule-out-lab-source-coronavirus-new-study-says-1504656
Scientists Shouldn't Rule Out Lab As Source of Coronavirus, New Study Says

A new scientific analysis of the novel coronavirus (SARS-CoV-2) has argued that scientists should not rule out the possibility that the virus originated in a laboratory setting, no matter how likely or unlikely that could be

While U.S. officials and intelligence agencies have held out the possibility of a leak from the Wuhan Institute of Virology, China has dismissed the idea as a conspiracy theory
...
China's position that the Coronavirus jumped species in nature, probably at a wet market in the city of Wuhan. That view has been in part based on the evidence that the COVID-19 virus was not genetically manipulated.

Scientists who looked at the study at Newsweek's request said that the analysis is unconventional and uses techniques that are unproven. They cautioned against drawing conclusions until more research can corroborate the analysis.

...
The new study, which has not been peer-reviewed and was published on the site bioRxiv hosted by Cold Spring Harbor Laboratory, notes that the novel virus is "well adapted for humans."  It was authored by scientists from the Department of Zoology & Biodiversity Research Center at the University of British Columbia, the Fusion Genomics Corporation and the Stanley Center for Psychiatric Research at the Broad Institute of MIT and Harvard.
...

"Our observations suggest that by the time SARS-CoV-2 was first detected in late 2019, it was already pre-adapted to human transmission to an extent similar to late epidemic SARS-CoV. However, no precursors or branches of evolution stemming from a less human-adapted SARS-CoV-2-like virus have been detected," the authors of the study explained in the abstract.

"The sudden appearance of a highly infectious SARS-CoV-2 presents a major cause for concern that should motivate stronger international efforts to identify the source and prevent near future re-emergence," they warned.
...
In conclusion, the study cautions that various possibilities for how the outbreak began in humans "means that we need to take precautions against each scenario to prevent re-emergence."


Offline Mr. Bill

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #258 on: May 17, 2020, 07:57:24 PM »
In 2015, the Wuhan lab performed a gain of function experiment using cut-and-paste genetic engineering, in which scientists take a natural virus and directly make substitutions in its RNA coding to make it more transmissible. They took a piece of the original SARS virus and inserted a snippet from a SARS-like bat coronavirus, resulting in a virus that is capable of infecting human cells.

Yes, but the very next sentence says:

Quote
A natural virus altered with these methods would be easily flagged in a genetic analysis, like a contemporary addition to an old Victorian house.

And this flagging is exactly what has not been found in the COVID-19 virus, AFAIK, except in some early flawed reports such as the withdrawn "HIV insertions" paper.

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #259 on: May 17, 2020, 08:15:11 PM »
Yes, but the very next sentence says:

And this flagging is exactly what has not been found in the COVID-19 virus, AFAIK, except in some early flawed reports such as the withdrawn "HIV insertions" paper.

The insertions study was withdrawn ftom that publication under Chinese threats.  As noted above, the findings were confirmed by multiple independent groups. Also, did you miss the point on that single Chinese funded "debunking" study?

Scientists who looked at the study at Newsweek's request said that the analysis is unconventional and uses techniques that are unproven. They cautioned against drawing conclusions until more research can corroborate the analysis.

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #260 on: May 18, 2020, 08:52:06 AM »
The insertions study was withdrawn ftom that publication under Chinese threats.

There were a lot more reasons than that.

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #261 on: May 18, 2020, 10:51:36 AM »
There were a lot more reasons than that.

I have not seen a single study refuting these insertions exist.  I've seen the one study with hand waving argument that they naturally evolved, but as per above this is more controversial than the original.   And some have argued that they werent bioenginered using strawman argument that the result had too low of a fatality rate and too high and infection rate to be a bioweapon.  But that is just silly thinking as gain of function research they were doing was precisely to create a high infection, low fatality virus.  And there also is a class of economic bioweapons with precisely that format (ie dont want to kill enemy, just cripple them).

If you know of research proving these insertions are not there, please post.  Because pretty much every team in the world have verified this, including those in China: http://chinaxiv.org/abs/202002.00004.

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #262 on: May 18, 2020, 12:58:04 PM »
If you know of research proving these insertions are not there, please post.  Because pretty much every team in the world have verified this, including those in China: http://chinaxiv.org/abs/202002.00004.

I don't understand how that link relates to whether there are genetically-engineered insertions.  It discusses the discovery of a specific mutation.  I have only read a translation of the abstract, not the entire paper, but it doesn't look relevant.

Quote
Wuhan 2019 coronavirus S protein may have Furin protease cleavage site

Abstract: In December 2019, Wuhan, China reported pneumonia caused by 2019 novel coronavirus (2019 novel Coronavirus, 2019-nCoV). Based on the genomic information, our previous research results showed that although 2019-nCoV and SARS coronavirus belong to Beta coronavirus subgroup B (BB coronavirus), the two viruses are very different. This result is consistent with the clinical symptoms of the two. The previous research also found that there are a large number of variable translations of BB coronavirus, and revealed the characteristics of rapid mutation and high diversity of BB coronavirus from the molecular level. This study is the first in the world to report an important mutation in the BB coronavirus S protein. This mutation gives 2019-nCoV a site for Furin protease cleavage, which is all other BB coronaviruses except murine hepatitis coronavirus ( Including SARS and SARS-like coronavirus). This mutation may enhance the efficiency of 2019-nCoV to infect cells, which in turn makes it more spreadable than SARS coronavirus. Due to this mutation, the packaging mechanism of the 2019 coronavirus will also be different from most other Beta coronaviruses such as SARS, and may be the same as that of the murine hepatitis coronavirus, HIV, Ebola virus and some avian influenza viruses. As an unexpected discovery, some avian influenza viruses can also obtain Furin protease cleavage sites by mutation. Subsequent research on this important mutation will lay a foundation for revealing the reasons for the strong spread of 2019-nCoV and the development of drugs, antibodies and vaccines.

There is no controversy over the nucleotide sequence in the virus.  Everyone has access to that data.  The issue is interpreting that data, to see if there's "a contemporary addition to an old Victorian house" (to use Newsweek's simile) or whether it's something you'd expect from natural evolution of the virus.  China has been ineffective in supressing this discussion, because both sides are all over the Internet, but as far as I can discover as an amateur, the majority of knowledgable people believe there are no human-designed "insertions", based on statistical analysis and an understanding of how viruses typically mutate.

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #263 on: May 18, 2020, 02:33:02 PM »
I don't understand how that link relates to whether there are genetically-engineered insertions.  It discusses the discovery of a specific mutation.  I have only read a translation of the abstract, not the entire paper, but it doesn't look relevant.

Those were the Chinese scientists who spoke out that virus was likely leaked from lab and confirmed HIV-like insertions but were then silenced.  This was followed by many others around world (India again. Taiwan, US, Canada, US, among others)  No-one to my knowledge has claimed these insertions do not exist, especially given they were basis of trying HIV anti-virals.

https://www.ccn.com/hiv-ebola-like-mutations-suggest-coronavirus-leaked-from-a-lab/
HIV & Ebola-Like Mutations Suggest Coronavirus Leaked From a Lab

According to researchers from Nanki University in Tianjin China, Covid-19 contains a strange HIV-like mutation that may make it more contagious and give it properties not found in other coronaviruses.

The Chinese study builds upon earlier research in India that concluded that the disease was unlikely to have originated in nature. This comes amid speculation that Covid-19 originated in a Chinese research lab located in Wuhan.
...
Covid-19 Has Novel Properties
In late January, Indian researchers publish a now-retracted paper that claimed to have found “HIV insertions” in the Wuhan coronavirus. They took this as evidence that the virus may have been manmade.

They stated the following:

This is startling as it is quite unlikely for a virus to have acquired such unique insertions naturally in a short duration of time. This structural change might have also increased the range of host cells that 2019-nCoV can infect
...
now, research from the Nankai University in Tianjin, China is reporting similar findings.

According to the new research, Covid-19’s ability to bind to cells is 100 to 1,000 times stronger than SARS. They claim that, unlike other coronaviruses, Covid-19 attacks a protein called furin – just like Ebola and HIV. They believe this is the reason why the virus seems to be significantly more infectious than similar diseases like SARS and MERS.

Covid-19’s unique furin pathway could be the reason why some doctors are finding limited success in treating the virus with HIV antiviral drugs.
...
Covid-19’s unique HIV-like properties support the controversial theory that the virus originated in a lab – specifically the Wuhan Institute of Virology located near the epicenter of the outbreak.

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #264 on: May 18, 2020, 02:51:02 PM »
This may be the worst attempt at gaslighting ever.

https://www.inquisitr.com/6059852/pentagon-contractor-coronavirus-report-false/amp/
Pentagon Contractor Report Suggesting Coronavirus Came From Wuhan Lab Is Provably False, Claims ‘Daily Beast’

Are the Chinese propagandists even trying anymore?  Guarded roadblocks were just routine street maintenance?  Cancelled conference wasnt cancelled because they have a selfie (despite dozens of attendees saying it was cut short after Shi was escorted out under guard)?  It is just common for the cell phones of top lab personnel to be turned off for weeks so nothing to see there? 

Meanwhile, after release of report, Xi agrees to "independent" investigation run by his WHO lapdog and sending billions to other countries to garner their support. Also, he wants to delay the investigation until after the pandemic has subsided (ie.until after US election when he hopes can exert influence on a new president once again).

https://www.usnews.com/news/world-report/articles/2020-05-18/xi-jinping-pledges-to-support-virus-investigation-as-china-casts-doubt-on-its-origin
Xi Pledges to Support Virus Investigation as China Casts Doubt on its Origin
The commitment comes even as Chinese state media says COVID-19 may have begun in the U.S.


Though public health experts consider China the source of the virus, it has publicly acknowledged only 84,000 cases – a fraction of the almost 5 million cases globally – and 4,600 deaths.
....
"China supports the idea of a comprehensive review of the global response to COVID-19 after it is brought under control to sum up experience and address deficiencies," he said. "This work should be based on science and professionalism, led by WHO and conducted in an objective and impartial manner."

Xi said China would provide $2 billion to developing countries to help with their responses to the spread of the coronavirus and will partner with 30 African countries to help strengthen their public health infrastructures.
...
Beijing has since imposed punitive measures against countries that have openly criticized its handling of the virus, including considering sanctions against individual U.S. politicians pushing legal action against China – an unprecedented move – and boycotting Australian goods after it called for an international investigation into the virus' origin. Xi did not address Australia's proposal on Monday.

The country has also attempted to shift the international narrative away from conclusions that the virus originated in Wuhan. As Xi spoke, Chinese state media promoted a theory that the virus actually originated in the U.S., not in China.


« Last Edit: May 18, 2020, 03:01:19 PM by iam4liberty »

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #265 on: May 18, 2020, 06:02:38 PM »
Knock, knock.
   Who's there?
Scientists. 
    Scientists WHO?
No, real scientists.
     Crap, lock the door and burn everything!

https://amp.sbs.com.au/v1/article/coalition-of-62-countries-back-australia-s-push-for-covid-19-pandemic-probe/8ba9681a-2b09-4ef8-bfde-8756e8fb0779
Coalition of 116 countries back Australia's push for independent coronavirus inquiry

More than 110 countries have backed Australia's push for an independent coronavirus inquiry which has caused a damaging rift with China.

The African Group's 54 member states will co-sponsor the motion, joining 62 other countries including Russia, Indonesia, India, Japan, Britain and Canada.
...
"I think the most important thing, rather than apportioning blame to one particular country or another country, is that we get to the bottom of what's happened. And part of that is about the origin, where this virus came from," he told reporters.
...
Beijing's man in Canberra raised the prospect of consumer boycotts of Australian products because of the push for an inquiry.

Since then, the barley threat has surfaced, while four major Australian abattoirs have been blocked from sending their product to China.

Offline Morning Sunshine

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #266 on: May 18, 2020, 06:35:37 PM »
Since then, the barley threat has surfaced, while four major Australian abattoirs have been blocked from sending their product to China.[/i]

so china is blocking imports of FOOD from Australia, and presumably other countries that agree with them?  Bring it. 

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #267 on: May 19, 2020, 07:45:39 AM »
WHO is the health organization for the whole world, except  when China says otherwise.  The country with the greatest independent insight into what happened in China must be excluded from all discussions.  Time to permanently cut all funding to WHO and replace them with an independent, non-corrupted organization

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2020/05/19/taiwan-says-it-is-disappointed-and-angry-being-excluded-from-who-meeting.html
Taiwan 'disappointed and angry' about being excluded from WHO meeting, says it is developing its own coronavirus vaccine

We feel disappointed and angry about WHO's decision of not inviting Taiwan to join this year's WHA, we feel we have so much to share about our successful experiences in this Covid-19 outbreak response" said Yi-Chun Lo, deputy director general at Taiwan Centers for Disease Control.
...
Taiwan has been lobbying to join this year's meeting as an observer after its success with containing the coronavirus outbreak. But it faced strong opposition from China
. .
Due to its exclusion from the WHO, Taiwan is relying on its own efforts in the race for a vaccine with health authorities working with academia and other industry partners.


How Taiwan, whose Vice President is considered one of the top epidimiologists in the world, contained COVID-19 and itsviews on its origin:

https://youtu.be/G1potR0eXA4
Taiwan’s vice president says 'possibility' that Covid-19 came from Chinese laboratory

In an interview with FRANCE 24, Taiwan’s Vice President Chen Chien-jen, an epidemiologist by training, discussed his country’s handling of the Covid-19 pandemic, while criticising the response of China and the World Health Organization. Chen refused to rule out the "possibility" that the coronavirus originated in a Chinese laboratory

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #268 on: May 20, 2020, 05:37:46 PM »
This article gives an overview of the early spread of the virus.  It doesn't pin down a specific origin, but it describes how this particular virus turned into a pandemic.

5/12/20: COVID-19: The Conjunction of Events Leading to the Coronavirus Pandemic and Lessons to Learn for Future Threats

Quote
Originally identified in December 2019 in Wuhan, China, SARS-CoV-2 has become a pandemic owing to a long period of incubation, a high number of asymptomatic cases, and high international mobility. Here we consider the unique conjunction of events that allowed this new coronavirus to emerge and create a pandemic. ...

The emergence of COVID-19 is the result of an exceptional “planetary alignment,” a specific coincidence of unrelated natural and societal traits. ... Although it cannot be excluded, there is no evidence of direct coronavirus infection of humans from bats. ... Similarly [to SARS and MERS], an intermediate animal might have been involved in the emergence of COVID-19. SARS-CoV-2 could possibly infect pangolin, cat, civet, cow, buffalo, swine, goat, sheep, and pigeon. ...epidemiological data show that early cases of COVID-19 were not related to HSWM [the Huanan seafood wholesale market] and thus that it is not the site of emergence. Phylogenetic studies suggest that SARS-CoV-2 might have circulated in Wuhan as early as October 2019 and that the virus then spread at low-level from person to person (the latency phase), before being imported to HSWM where it was detected in December 2019. The location of the first human infection will most likely remain unknown. Contamination through traditional medicine, pets, or any other contact event between humans and the source of the virus, including the handling of viruses in a laboratory, must be considered. The initial contact might also have taken place in farms, since anthropized rural areas offer favorable environments for the transmission of coronaviruses. In this latency phase, the infection remained silent, spreading in a stochastic way within the population, with no epidemic identified yet.

... To move from the latency phase to the epidemic phase, an amplification process must occur to reach the threshold needed to trigger an epidemic. The outbreak was initially detected in the Jiang'an district, which is home to the environmentally-conscious Baibuting urban community, which holds a traditional folk festival known as Wan Jia Yan or Great Family Feast every year. The 20th such event, organized on January 18, 2020, coincided with the very popular Lunar New Year celebration. More than 40,000 families, who prepared about 14,000 traditional dishes, attended Wan Jia Yan in January 2020. ... What triggered the epidemic is the simultaneous occurrence of two major celebrations in the same place, bringing many people into contact with the initially infected persons and providing the amplification phase needed. Another key step was mobility. The Chinese New Year is associated with an outbound mass mobilization known as Chun Yun, and Wuhan is both the heart of the Yangtze River Economic Belt and a major national hub in China known as “the gateway of nine provinces.” An estimated 5 million people left Wuhan during Chun Yun in 2020. Furthermore, Wuhan welcomes 1.2 million college students, whose mobility during holidays is extremely high. Outbound traveling from Wuhan may explain why Wenzhou, in the neighboring province of Zhejiang, became one of the most severely affected areas. At that stage, it was too late to stop the epidemic, and measures could not be anything but post-event reactions. The expansion was driven in secondary foci by people who moved from the initial location of the epidemic. In each of these foci, the same processes of latency, amplification, and epidemic were reiterated with variable delays. This is why SARS-CoV-2 was not stopped despite drastic measures of containment and quarantine. The next step, global dissemination, was only a matter of dissemination due to intensive international mobility and global international trade. ...

Offline iam4liberty

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Re: Virus accidentally released from lab ?
« Reply #269 on: May 21, 2020, 08:02:13 AM »
https://www.theweek.in/news/world/2020/05/19/novel-coronavirus-is-human-made-says-australia-study.amp.html
Novel coronavirus is human-made, says Australia study
New study finds evidence of a sign of human intervention in COVID-19 pandemic


The team led by Nikolai Petrovsky, Professor of Medicine at Flinders University, has suggested that SARS-CoV-2 was likely genetically engineered that led the virus naturally evolving in an animal subject to be effective at attaching to human cells.
...
The team observed that “the novel coronavirus most powerfully binds with human ACE2, and with variously lesser degrees of effectiveness with animal versions of the receptor.”

Thus the study suggests that the deadly virus was manufactured in a laboratory in order to penetrate human cells.

 “A virus would be expected to have highest affinity for the receptor in its original host species, e.g. bat, with a lower initial binding affinity for the receptor of any new host, e.g. humans. However, in this case, the affinity of SARS-CoV-2 is higher for humans than for the putative original host species, bats, or for any potential intermediary host species,” the study pointed out.
...
“there are some highly unusual features, including optimal human adaptation, that in the absence of identification of a close to identical virus in an animal population from which COVID19 could have arisen, would point in the direction of human intervention at some point in the evolution of COVID19.”