Author Topic: Sikh religion - carry weapons for self defense  (Read 969 times)

Offline surfivor

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Sikh religion - carry weapons for self defense
« on: August 02, 2017, 10:31:26 AM »

 Sikhism is apparently the 5th largest religion on the world.

 I was not aware, though maybe I had heard before but apparently due to the invasion by Islam into India, Sikhism arose and eventually led to a religion where carrying swords and weapons was part of the religion in order to protect oneself from muslims at least according to one Sikh man I heard explain this.

 Anyway, here are some articles:

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/mar/28/sikh-man-cites-religion-lawsuit-against-gun-contro/

A Sikh man is suing the state of California over its gun laws, arguing they violate his First Amendment rights to practice his religion by barring him from carrying the kind of weapons he says he needs for self-defense.

Gursant Singh Khalsa, a practicing Sikh for 35 years, charges in the lawsuit filed this month that California’s laws banning military-style, semiautomatic weapons and high-capacity magazines violate mainstream Sikh doctinre requiring Sikhs “be at all time fully prepared to defend themselves and others against injustice.”

“We’re required to wear what’s called a kirpan” or dagger, he said Thursday. “I feel, as far as my religion goes, it dictates that we should have all weapons of all kinds to defend ourselves. By not being able to carry an assault rifle or weapon that has a high-capacity magazine, I don’t feel that I can defend myself or my family.”

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https://www.sikhnet.com/news/gun-violence-freedom-bear-arms-sikh-perspective-part-iii-iii

The Sikh example shows that Sikhs have followed a robust arms bearing tradition, The Gurus in fact placed a larger responsibility on the Sikhs i.e. not only to take personal responsibility for their lives and not blame any for their misfortunes but also to be prepared to make sacrifices for righteous values and help protect the just rights of others. This broad objective possibly should resonate with the variety of eventualities that the founding fathers may have had in mind when setting out the second amendment right to bear arms.


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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sikhism#Historical_influences

Sikhism developed while the region was being ruled by the Mughal Empire. Two of the Sikh gurus – Guru Arjan and Guru Tegh Bahadur, after they refused to convert to Islam, were tortured and executed by the Mughal rulers. The Islamic era persecution of Sikhs triggered the founding of the Khalsa, as an order for freedom of conscience and religion. A Sikh is expected to embody the qualities of a "Sant-Sipāhī" – a saint-soldier.


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https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2015/10/16/sikhs-knives-and-religious-exemptions/?utm_term=.42d3c27de713

https://thepatriotperspective.wordpress.com/2013/03/29/sikhs-clinging-to-guns-and-religion/

Offline archer

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Re: Sikh religion - carry weapons for self defense
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2017, 12:34:08 PM »
I don’t see a problem with them carrying arms as long as the rest of us can carry the same arms.


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Offline Smurf Hunter

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Re: Sikh religion - carry weapons for self defense
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2017, 04:37:09 PM »
On my visit to India years back, it was explained to me that if a Kirpan is brandished in public, it must draw blood.  Sounds maybe like BS, but the adage goes if you don't plan to use it, keep it sheathed, or cut yourself with it.  That said, many CCW folks follow the idea "don't draw your gun unless you are prepared to use it".

Offline archer

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Re: Sikh religion - carry weapons for self defense
« Reply #3 on: August 02, 2017, 07:32:17 PM »
On my visit to India years back, it was explained to me that if a Kirpan is brandished in public, it must draw blood.  Sounds maybe like BS, but the adage goes if you don't plan to use it, keep it sheathed, or cut yourself with it.  That said, many CCW folks follow the idea "don't draw your gun unless you are prepared to use it".

exactly.. that's called brandishing.


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Offline RitaRose1945

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Re: Sikh religion - carry weapons for self defense
« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2017, 04:32:22 AM »
exactly.. that's called brandishing.


And it will get you into a LOT of legal trouble.

Offline surfivor

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Re: Sikh religion - carry weapons for self defense
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2017, 08:25:29 AM »
 I told my mother who is kind of a liberal that Sikhs in California want to be able to carry firearms because that is their religion and it's a first amendment thing besides a second amendment thing. She says they should go live someplace else so there is a liberal perspective for you.

I was listening to some audio on this which seems complicated but shows you how other parts of the world are different. People don't agree on whether or not this event was right or not. A General in the Indian military has needed police protection for 25 years because the Sikhs want to assassinate him and apparently have tried. The Sikhs are like a separate ethnic group besides a religion. Many sikhs occupy northwest India near the pakistan border and it seems there have been tensions there because of pakistans muslims and that some Sikh holy areas may be in pakistan

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1984_anti-Sikh_riots

The 1984 anti-Sikh riots, also known as the 1984 Sikh Massacre or 1984 genocide of Sikhs, was a series of pogroms directed against Sikhs in India, by anti-Sikh mobs, most notably by members of the Congress party, in response to the assassination of Indira Gandhi by her Sikh bodyguards. Official Indian government reports admit to about 2,800 deaths across India, including 2,100 in Delhi.Other independent sources estimate the number of deaths to be around 8,000, including at least 3,000 in Delhi. The Central Bureau of Investigation, the main Indian investigating agency, believes the acts of violence were organised with the support from the then Delhi police and some central government officials. Rajiv Gandhi was sworn in as Prime Minister after his mother's death and, when asked about the riots, said "when a big tree falls, the earth shakes".

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 This is interesting, Sikhs apparently are exempt from certain weapons laws in India:

https://www.quora.com/Can-a-non-Sikh-carry-a-kirpan-knife-in-India-legally

a non-sikh cannot carry a kirpan or knife legally. Under Article 25 only Sikhs have been permission to carry kirpans/knives as a part of their religious practice and profession of their faith.

However, if a non-sikh carries he/she maybe booked under Indian Arms Act and would be liable for punishment.

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kirpan is a sword or knife

http://www.singhlawyers.com/sikh-cant-be-restrained-from-carrying-kirpan-in-court/

Sikh’s Can’t be Restrained From Carrying Kirpan in Court


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http://reason.com/blog/2014/10/27/if-sikhs-can-bring-knives-into-schools-w

If Sikh Kids Can Bring Knives to School, Why Can't Everyone Else?

Late last week, administrators at a Washington state school district decided to let a Sikh boy carry the kirpan on school property. The kirpan is a ceremonial knife central to the Sikh faith; all baptized Sikhs are expected to carry one.

The decision, according to KING 5 News, merely confirmed standard practice. "Plenty of Sikhs, both students and staff" have worn their kirpans at school for years, it seems. Administrators recognized that this is an exception to state and federal zero tolerance weapons policies, which strictly prohibit guns and knives—even pretend ones—anywhere near a school.


« Last Edit: August 03, 2017, 08:54:59 AM by surfivor »