Author Topic: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)  (Read 254238 times)

Offline FreeLancer

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #30 on: February 22, 2013, 12:52:00 AM »
well, btc incurs markups, too.  A lot of places charge 3% or more for exchanging dollars to btc, so that would make the price $31.42.

Wow, what places are charging those rates? 

Mt. Gox has only charged me between 0.5 - 0.6% for my trades.  Dwolla hasn't charged me anything for the transfer of USD from my bank to Mt. Gox.

Offline velacreations

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #31 on: February 22, 2013, 08:01:51 AM »
bitinstant, I think. 

Virwox charges 11.5+%

BitPay is about 1%

Offline FreeLancer

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #32 on: March 05, 2013, 07:54:36 PM »
Price just hit $43/btc today, it was $23 less than a month ago. 

Offline FreeLancer

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #33 on: March 12, 2013, 09:04:16 PM »
While bitcoin has been on a roller coaster of volatility the last few weeks, the latest 23% sell off early this morning was precipitated by a glitch in the underlying software code, which caused a sell off at Mt. Gox and prompted them to temporarily suspend trading.  Previous panics had been attributed to tales of coins stolen due to poor internet security.  This was totally different.

Apparently, upgrades to the database engine in version 0.8 caused a bifurcation in the blockchain that could have led to potential double spending of the same coins, which is specifically something it was designed to avoid.  Given that it's a distributed system, with no centralized control point, there were some miners using v0.7 who were arriving at different values for newly minted coins than those who were evaluating the same blocks but using v0.8. 

I really have nothing more than a vague idea how this stuff works.  Don't they say not to invest in anything you don't understand?  This is the bleeding edge of a new technology, there's certainly risk to investing in this currency, so don't trade in any of your existing wealth if you would feel bad about loosing it forever down the rat hole of cyberspace. 

Amazingly, the price has already rebounded and is back above $45, within 10% of it's all-time high, and this seems to be due to the fact that the community is still small and nimble enough to get their fingers in the dike and avert disaster.  We will see where this goes from here.

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #34 on: March 13, 2013, 10:55:10 AM »
Thanks for the update FreeLancer, I have not invested in any bitcoin yet, and maybe never will, but it does interest me.

Offline Prodigy

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #35 on: March 13, 2013, 11:17:34 AM »
I would also advise against any heavy investment because of the volatility, but I would highly suggest that everyone at least get a couple of bitcoins and join the community.  Maybe spend them once in awhile where you can, and see how it goes.  Supporting this can only lead to good things for the future of currencies, even if this particular one doesn't make it in the long run.

Does anyone have experience with mining?  I was looking into the new Butterfly Labs mining servers, and considering a purchase.  I don't think it's going to be something to make money from (my guess is you might be able to make back the purchase of the hardware within a year or two) but it's another cool way to support the community.

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #36 on: March 13, 2013, 11:59:30 AM »
Here's a bitcoin thread I launched a few months ago which got mostly ignored.

http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=39393.msg442764#msg442764

Merge??



[Topics are now merged -- Mr. Bill]
« Last Edit: March 15, 2013, 11:55:38 AM by Mr. Bill »

Offline FreeLancer

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #37 on: March 13, 2013, 06:41:41 PM »
Here's a bitcoin thread I launched a few months ago which got mostly ignored.

http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=39393.msg442764#msg442764

Merge??

There's no getting around it, this dubious bitcoin community is a motley assortment of techno-anarchists, pariah nations like Iran, seedy purveyors of vice and inequity, and a few mild-mannered guys like me.  But we're all giving the powers-that-be the finger, one bitcoin at a time!

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I have to tell you I'm struggling to understand how bitcoins work. I watch the instructional videos and I'm lost. This is a big thing that apparently is going unnoticed by many, note that the topic died upon posting. Can someone help out here? http://www.weusecoins.com/ This vid doesn't tell me how it works, how do you exchange dollars for bitcoins, and make purchases, and back to dollars?

Offline nimzy88

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http://www.npr.org/blogs/money/2011/07/13/137795648/the-tuesday-podcast-bitcoin

This money planet podcast did a pretty great job a describing bit coins. I remember listening to it when it came out.

Not sure how it has changed over the last year or 2.

Offline FreeLancer

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I have to tell you I'm struggling to understand how bitcoins work. I watch the instructional videos and I'm lost. This is a big thing that apparently is going unnoticed by many, note that the topic died upon posting. Can someone help out here? http://www.weusecoins.com/ This vid doesn't tell me how it works, how do you exchange dollars for bitcoins, and make purchases, and back to dollars?

I like to think of bitcoins as being an encrypted tally sheet, or ledger, that is shared between everyone who owns a piece of the bitcoin pie.  A system of public and private keys anonymously verifies and protects ownership of your "coins" and the system is designed to carefully track the transfer of "coins" from one owner to another so there is no double spending or chargebacks.  There is no central authority that manages/controls everything and the software that manages this encrypted ledger is open source so that the chances that anyone has a backdoor into the piggy-bank is extremely low.

The main exchange for bitcoins is an internet site named Mt. Gox where you can trade with major currencies.  It's a little challenge getting dollars into Mt. Gox, but not that bad once you're set up.  The easiest way to get bitcoins would be to find someone who is willing to sell you coins in person, create a bitcoin wallet (which is just the name for the electronic tally sheet), and have them transfer directly into your account while you're face to face.

I've shared a little of my experience acquiring bitcoins on this thread:  http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=27624.0

I don't pretend to fully understand all the nuts and bolts of this experiment, but I do think it holds promise as a novel way to secure and transfer wealth without the intrusion of third parties (theft by taxes) and figure the best way to learn the system is to dive in and put some skin in the game.  But realize this is a speculative risk, don't bet the farm on it.

Offline Prodigy

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #41 on: March 15, 2013, 10:02:05 AM »
Here's a bitcoin thread I launched a few months ago which got mostly ignored.

http://thesurvivalpodcast.com/forum/index.php?topic=39393.msg442764#msg442764

Merge??

"The topic or board you are looking for appears to be either missing or off limits to you."

I am not special enough to view that, apparently.  Probably why it was mostly ignored, too?

Offline nimzy88

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #42 on: March 15, 2013, 10:58:45 AM »
I posted this in the other bitcoin thread. Thought some people new to bitcoins would be interested. It also includes a history of how bitcoins started.

http://www.npr.org/blogs/money/2011/07/13/137795648/the-tuesday-podcast-bitcoin

This money planet podcast did a pretty great job a describing bit coins. I remember listening to it when it came out.

Not sure how it has changed over the last year or 2.

Offline Mr. Bill

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #43 on: March 15, 2013, 11:59:04 AM »
"The topic or board you are looking for appears to be either missing or off limits to you."

I am not special enough to view that, apparently.  Probably why it was mostly ignored, too?

I merged that topic into this one, so it's all in this thread now.

Oil Lady's topic was originally posted in one of our political boards, which are available to most members after they've made a substantial number of forum posts.  More info on this policy: The Primary Role of The Survival Podcast Forums.

Offline Prodigy

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #44 on: March 18, 2013, 11:22:05 AM »
I merged that topic into this one, so it's all in this thread now.

Oil Lady's topic was originally posted in one of our political boards, which are available to most members after they've made a substantial number of forum posts.  More info on this policy: The Primary Role of The Survival Podcast Forums.

Thanks for the info.  I knew there was a minimum post count for a bunch of other boards, which I found after 10 posts, but I didn't realize there was another level of minimum posts.  Good to know!

I don't pretend to fully understand all the nuts and bolts of this experiment, but I do think it holds promise as a novel way to secure and transfer wealth without the intrusion of third parties (theft by taxes) and figure the best way to learn the system is to dive in and put some skin in the game.  But realize this is a speculative risk, don't bet the farm on it.

Well said!

Thox Spuddy

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #45 on: March 18, 2013, 02:19:11 PM »
On a scale of 1 to 10, is there prepper value in bitcoin useage? (1=low value)

Offline MTUCache

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #46 on: March 18, 2013, 02:41:55 PM »
On a scale of 1 to 10, is there prepper value in bitcoin useage? (1=low value)
Gotta get a 2 or 3 from me, although I admittedly don't know as much as I'd like to about it. That's nothing against Bitcoins specifically, but more about what it is that you're preparing for and how that will impact your ability to use that asset when you need to.

In a prepper-mindset, you've got tangible assets, paper assets, and digital assets. The line between paper and digital is already completely wiped out.
I'm not one of those "bullets, beans and band-aids!" guys who only believe in what I can hold in my hand and use directly, but I'm also more than a little bit leery about something I can't physically touch and has the possibility of being hacked.

Truthfully, with the way financial transactions are handled today, and the reputations that most banks have been working hard to achieve over the last few years, it's not like Bitcoins should be looked at as any more risky than any other digital form of wealth. Just because it doesn't exist somewhere physically doesn't make it any less valuable than a paper bill or a physical item that you aren't allowed to touch or even see... 

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #47 on: March 18, 2013, 05:17:11 PM »
I would wonder if in the event of a economic collapse if the bitcoin system makes a way to store reserves.

Offline FreeLancer

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #48 on: March 18, 2013, 09:08:07 PM »
On a scale of 1 to 10, is there prepper value in bitcoin useage? (1=low value)

The prepper value of bitcoin wealth is highly dependent on whose vision of the future turns out to be correct. 

If your version of SHTF tends towards a global meltdown of multiple support systems, then bitcoin will likely turn out to be a loss.  Although, if the grid comes back, your bitcoins will still be there, provided you safeguard your private keys, and if there's still a market for them, they will have value.  In this scenario, I would rate bitcoin wealth a value of 2 or 3.

My vision of the bad times ahead are not as apocalyptic as most, but do tend toward the dystopian.  I see technology advancing steadily, which will make tracking our every move much easier, and this increased surveillance by governments, in collusion with corporations, means our wealth is vulnerable to confiscation through either outright seizure, or via theft by taxation.  This is where I see value in a currency scheme like bitcoin.  It's off the books wealth that is relatively easy to secure and transfer, and it's for all practical purposes anonymous.  Memorize your private key and you have the ability to cross borders and have instant access to your bitcoin wealth.  No swallowing diamonds or secreting bullion in your shoes required.  Provided the grid stays up, which I believe to be the most likely scenario, I would rate bitcoin a 7 or 8.

At this moment 1 BTC = $52, down from it's all-time high today of $52.87.  Is this what it felt like when gold went parabolic from a few hundred dollars an ounce?

Offline Prodigy

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #49 on: March 19, 2013, 01:13:44 PM »
At this moment 1 BTC = $52, down from it's all-time high today of $52.87.  Is this what it felt like when gold went parabolic from a few hundred dollars an ounce?

Seriously, even for a supporter of Bitcoins, the fluctuations are kind of frustrating.  You'd be insane to try and 'day trade' them, but I still think they're a good idea for the long term.

Offline FreeLancer

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #50 on: March 19, 2013, 01:32:37 PM »
It is crazy to day trade and I'm just focusing on buying the big dips at this point and holding for the long term.  It went to $62 this morning and back down to $57.  I've got some open buy orders set to kick in at $35 and below, which seemed reasonable last week, but who knows if it will dip that low again.

Offline Prodigy

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #51 on: March 21, 2013, 10:29:37 AM »
BitPay Integrates Bitcoin with Fulfillment by Amazon.com

http://www.cnbc.com/id/100527259

When this goes through, this could make the value of the bitcoin absolutely explode.  I'm frustrated at the $60+ price tag now, but it could be in the hundreds or thousands after this takes off.  That also makes mining an even more appealing option.  If I ever start mining, I'll post updates on how it goes.

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #52 on: March 21, 2013, 08:21:15 PM »
Oh-oh!
Quote
US Begins Regulating BitCoin, Will Apply "Money Laundering" Rules To Virtual Transactions
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-03-21/us-begins-regulating-bitcoin-will-consider-virtual-transactions-money-laundering

Offline Tyronedeblanco

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #54 on: March 21, 2013, 09:29:37 PM »
Apparently it has the potential for taking down the Fed. The war is on.

Offline FreeLancer

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #55 on: March 21, 2013, 11:08:49 PM »
The FinCen rules are a mixed bag.  On the one hand, it appears that they have no desire to go after individual users of BTC, those who are using it to barter for goods and services, or just accumulating them for the hell of it (like me).  But they will definitely be focusing attention on businesses, like Mt. Gox, which function at the intersection between government-backed currencies and BTC.  But that makes sense, it's relatively easy to monitor traditional business banking, just look at the squeeze the Fed can put on just about any banking entity in the world, even the Swiss.

Some are attributing the recent run up in the BTC market on this announcement, they see it as a legitimizing step which has provided boundary-lines that take away a great deal of the regulatory uncertainty surrounding adoption of the scheme.  Other supporters feel this is the kiss of death. 

I don't know how any of this is going to turn out, but it's probably time to start testing the process of converting back to dollars via Mt. Gox and Dwolla, just to see what hoops I'll need to jump through if I need to get serious about liquidation in the future.

1 BTC = $73.75 at this very moment.  I can't believe it was briefly below $37 just 10 days ago and it's really not in my nature to be this speculative with cold-hard cash.  Who knows where it will go from here, some (Max Keiser on Alex Jones ::)) are saying $100,000, or more.  But I wouldn't bet the farm on it.  Farms aren't likely to just disappear into the cyber-ether, like bitcoin could do tomorrow.

Offline Cedar

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #56 on: March 22, 2013, 03:25:32 PM »
http://gma.yahoo.com/blogs/abc-blogs/man-lists-bungalow-bitcoins-115706957--abc-news-savings-and-investment.html

Taylor More is selling his family's bungalow with an asking price of $405,000 (that's Canadian dollars) or 5,521 Bitcoins. He would rather have the Bitcoins.

Cedar

Offline FreeLancer

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #57 on: March 22, 2013, 07:56:27 PM »
Taylor More is selling his family's bungalow with an asking price of $405,000 (that's Canadian dollars) or 5,521 Bitcoins. He would rather have the Bitcoins.

It will be interesting to see if he'll get any takers. 

One of the criticisms of BTC is that it is designed to be deflationary, there will only be 21 million coins minted in the scheme, with half of them already in circulation and the other half set to be minted at a much slower rate over the next 120 years, or so.  With a cap on the ability to produce new coins, if the existing coins become more desirable, their value will increase, which doesn't incentivize spending.  Some speculate that this deflationary design spells the ultimate failure of bitcoin.

Why would you buy a house with 5500 btc today, when the same house next year will likely sell for some fraction of that amount?  This is a very foreign concept for those of us used to seeing the purchasing power of our inflationary (government-backed) currencies decrease in a more, or less, predictable fashion.  Some say this makes BTC more like gold, a store of value which is hoarded more than it is spent, but time will have to be the judge of that.

The bitcoin price today has drifted down slightly, hovering around $70.  I guess everyone's taking some deep breaths and trying to figure out what the hell to do next.

Offline Cedar

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #58 on: March 27, 2013, 07:27:23 PM »
http://www.forbes.com/sites/nowthisnews/2013/03/26/the-world-is-getting-a-bitcoin-atm/

Canadian entrepreneur Jeff Berwick will capitalize on Cyprus’ financial woes by installing the world’s first Bitcoin ATM on the island. Bitcoin — if you’ve missed it — is the decentralized web-based currency, without the backing of a bank or government.

Cedar

Offline FreeLancer

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Re: Bitcoin currency (merged topics)
« Reply #59 on: March 28, 2013, 09:12:58 PM »
Starting to see an upswing in articles from the MSM regarding bitcoin, which appears to be due to the Euro jitters surrounding the Cyprus issue.  Here's one from BusinessWeek that I found interesting and does a good job of touching on the pertinent issues surrounding the concept.

1 BTC = $88 at this moment.   It went as high as $95 today, as well as plummeting briefly to $75.